Islamists are rising in America while we sleep

This week we covered two key stories that I’m quite certain aren’t getting much play: the rejection of Muslim women’s advocate Ayaan Hirsi Ali by Brandeis University and the Muslim Brotherhood forming a political bloc in America.

We are indeed witnessing the rise of Islamists in America. How has it come to this, that such a small minority has gained such a powerful political voice and influence? How is it that an organization like the Council for American Islamic Relations (CAIR) is even allowed to exist in our Republic?

It’s simple, we have become so damn politically correct that a vile organization that was an unindicted co-conspirator in the largest Islamic terrorist funding case in America can thumb its nose and by intimidation and coercion deny free speech and freedom of expression in our country. We have fallen under the spell of the bumper sticker “coexist” and have failed to heed the lessons of history.

What is even worse, we have failed to even take this enemy — yep, I mean it –enemy to heart for what they have openly stated their objective to be. Just read the Strategic Memorandum discovered in 1991 if you still have any doubts.

However, most importantly, we have seen a class of political cowards who castigate those of us who recognize this enemy as “Islamophobes” and “extremists.”

And why is that possible? Because we refuse to develop our own energy independence so that we can tell OPEC and the 56 nations of the Organization of Islamic Cooperation to get bent. Instead, they use our petrodollars to hold us hostage, fund their Islamic terrorism, export their materiel propaganda, and worst of all, buy off American political cowards.

We need to follow the money in America from these Islamist organizations to any politician and defeat them. We then need to find courageous men and women who will be relentless in identifying these Islamist infiltrators and their enablers, and ban them from operating in our country. If the Egyptians can categorize the Muslim Brotherhood as a terrorist group, so should the United States of America. And in turn, classify those groups associated and listed in the Strategic Memorandum of the Muslim Brotherhood as terrorist organizations and cease their operations in America.

This is no laughing matter. It is not about “freedom of religion” — as a matter of fact, Islam stopped being a religion in 622 when Muhammad decided to undertake the “”hejira” (migration) and departed Mecca for Medina.

When he returned to Mecca in 628 iit was after breaking the Treaty of Hudaibiya and massacring the occupants of Mecca in the Battle of the Trenches. Thus began the violent march of the theocratic-political totalitarian system, a global scourge for the past 1400 years known as Islam. America battled this enemy in the Barbary Wars, first from1801-1805, and then in 1815. The specter of the past has returned, but do we have a Jefferson and Madison who will give the order to crush this enemy — or will we continue down the path with feckless, accommodating, and acquiescing leadership which offers the throat of our Republic to this rabid barbaric foe?

If there is one thing that is bipartisan it is the failure of Democrat and Republican senior elected officials to confront this enemy — and therefore they exploit this weakness.

I cannot say this often and enough: When tolerance becomes a one-way street, it leads to cultural suicide.

Sorry, I ain’t going down this way, and to Nihad Awad, Ibrahim Hooper, and all the other Muslim Brotherhood facilitators and Islamists in America — enjoy it for now, but your dawg don’t hunt!

636 COMMENTS

  1. I’m more concerned about radical muslims wanting to kill me than anyone else.
    but as to subverting the Constitution and our way of life…
    I’m more worried about radical Christians usurping the law than radical muslims.

    • What has actually happened…is that the US has been departing from the God-influenced policies. The “radical christian” image is a straw man…which media/commentators/professors have set up…usually by finding a Westboro baptist or other extreme example…and ignoring the VAST good done by christian people/churches/parachurch orgs.

      • Read our documents. The founding fathers worked on the presumption that God has granted all “certain inalienable rights” but also…our liberty is to be bounded by law (See the song America the Beautiful for a good expression…).

    • Brendan, just because some Christians don’t believe in gay marriages and other things, doesn’t make them bad. Look at the number of Muslims that Obama has put into government positions and the number he has allowed and is still allowing into “Our Country”. I’m more worried about the Muslims then I’m worried about radical Christians.

    • That’s the most ignorant post on this page.

      If you are more worried about “radical” Christians somehow demanding your First Amendment rights, you need to bone up on Sharia. You let the Islamists gain power and there IS no Constitution. Some misguided Christians have been so rude as to ask for prayer in schools (which is a bad idea) and half the country still supports traditional marriage, but how are you with beheadings for thieves, stonings for women who appear in public without their burkas, and public executions of all who won’t profess faith in Allah? Me, I don’t think any of that is a very good idea.

      • Radical muslims are plotting to kill me,… but so far, it’s only been radical Christians making any real progress in usurping the Constitution.

      • there have been over 22.000 terror attacks around the world since 9/11 all but a handful perpetrated by muslims all with the intent on killing… all with the premice of an imam and a mosque some in countries were the muslims are a minority.. but many in countries were the muslims have the majority (what does that tell you) when muslims have the upper hand your toast!!! the secular muslims and minorities are most in peril and are slaughtered when fanatical muslims are trying to assert a more totalitarian regime to make everyone a fanatic so that everyone sensors everyone else…and when there is any decent there is mayem secular and non muslims alike are targets.. and contrary to what muslims and organisations like CAIR and ISNA would have you believe the most oppressed group of people on the planet are Christians not muslims they come way down the list…

      • You offer insults without offering any actual thoughts to refute what I wrote.
        Go play somewhere else child.

      • You’re a hypocrite, Scolding her for her insults while you do the same. Shame on you.
        You are also very wrong, There are no radical christians trying to usurp the Constitution only the muslims and they aren’t radical muslims, they are just muslims

      • Thank you sir. I have ran into Brendan before and this is just the same old statements he puts forth. Although calling me a child is quite flattering.

      • I’ve read your posts and I know that you don’t believe radical christians are trying to usurp our laws… because you support it.
        You’re also someone who has no ability to distinguish between radical muslims and the rest.
        Calling yourself a patriot doesn’t make you one.

      • Are you daft? I have never supported any religion ever. You have totally lost you mind which doesn’t surprise me any. Your troll like projections don’t bother me because it is you saying it.
        You have no clue who I am or what I am about, and even though you served our country you are a disgrace to the uniform which you wore.
        You are doing nothing but showing me your total ignorance on the subject. “It is better to keep your mouth shut and let people think your stupid than to open your mouth and prove them right.”

        Muslims follow the koran in total not just parts of it. Therefore they are all the same just as Christians believe in God. Not all Christians are Catholics. just as there are shiites and others but the all follow the koran not all christians follow the bible..
        You show me proof that there are Christians try to usurp the constitution, provide us with links.
        I DARE YOU!. why? because there are none.
        Calling yourself a vet does mean you really earned it

      • -Anti gay laws based on their religious beliefs
        -So-called religious freedom laws that allow religious beliefs to counter history and science in public schools.
        -Displays of religious icons on public lands and government buildings.
        -Blue laws, prohibiting business on Sundays or sale of alcohol
        -Proposed laws prohibiting other religions from building houses of worship

        Those are a few examples of Christians forcing (or attempting to force) their religion on others through the law.

        Go cash your disability handout check and don’t question my patriotism. and go talk to some American muslims instead of repeating paranoid internet conspiracies

      • Your patriotism is about as worthless as t–ts on a Bull. There are no anti gay laws. People have a right to serve anyone they choose, no shirt no shoes no service, I know you have seen those signs on doors. You are truly ignorant of laws. BLUE LAWS are laws that aren’t followed any longer, yes they are still on the books but never ever enforced. In this country the government was founded with God in mind Read the constitution and the Bill of Rights, again if you do not believe me.
        Show me where there are laws prohibiting building Churches or mosques they aren’t any.
        You make all these assertions but you cannot prove any of it.
        Go cash your welfare check and go play in traffic. By the way my disability is MY money That I EARNED for 36 years. it is not a hand out from the government. You truly are revealing you stupidity

      • okay taker? You are more whacked than I first thought. You don’t want to face the truth. You don’t want to face reality. You stick to your support of the muslim faith and you will regret ever trying.It will bite you were your brain is in your butt.

        You have a child you said.( let’s say for this debate that your child is of legal age Are you going to let your child convert to the muslim faith?
        You really believe that the student says he has never heard of sharia law? or that his family ever followed sharia law? He is a liar.
        The examples that they talk about in the USA article with Roger Williams, None of those religions were anything like the muslim faith, none of those religions want to convert the world to their laws of the land none of those faiths tell anyone convert or die.

        I read quite well and you edited what you wrote, nice try. You like the muslim religion so well then convert, remain dumb with your head in the sand.You obviously never learn from your mistakes.
        40 people could tell you that water is wet and you would argue that it is clear and cold that wet has nothing to do with it.

      • There is no thought or ways to refute ignorance. You have stated no facts to be refuted. You are only here trolling for a fight. What is your point?

      • I have stated that radical christians are trying to change our laws and force their beliefs on others.
        Here are some examples (facts)…

        -Anti gay laws based on their religious beliefs
        -So-called religious freedom laws that allow religious beliefs to counter history and science in public schools.
        -Displays of religious icons on public lands and government buildings.
        -Blue laws, prohibiting business on Sundays or sale of alcohol

        -Proposed laws prohibiting other religions from building houses of worship

        Those are a few examples of Christians forcing (or attempting to force) their religion on others through the law.
        So all you people worried about Muslims changing our laws… something that has not happened at all in any state… you should really be concerned about all the Christians who are, in fact, succeeding at changing our laws.
        Because if the day ever comes where muslims do decide to go to court and try to push their religion into our laws, the door will already be open thanks to christians who set legal precedent.

        Now… if you wish to refute or ask about anything I wrote… go ahead.
        If you just want to hurl insults, with no counter thoughts, take it elsewhere.

      • When you speak of “radical” Christians it only comprises a way of thought. All Christians are asking for is equal rights to honor their beliefs. They do not believe in gay marriage. That is their right, nothing radical about it. The businesses that have refused are the mom and pop type that provide “personal ” service. Like baking a cake, that is a hands on job. Or catering a wedding. If LGBT were not bullies they would respect their views and go to another business. If they want to get married,fine, civil laws are changing.

        It is a personal belief for some people that are at odds with science. That also is their right. I as a Seventh Day Adventist have no such problems. I believe in God and science. All some Christians think is if they are going to teach evolution than what is wrong with teaching creation. All knowledge is good and we can choose what we believe.

        As to displays of religious Icons on Government property. Where in the constitution does it prohibit this? Instead our forefathers founded this Nation on Christians principles. The Constitution was written to keep a Government for establishing a mandatory religion. That was what they were fleeing from. If you did not worship the mandated religion you could be jailed,tortured and killed for heresy. There is no such intent from Christians in this vein.

        Blue laws. If you investigate when these laws were passed you would find it has been on the books for ages and nobody follows them. My small town Christian city has just passed and ordinance to allow liquor to be bought on Sunday. In places where it is on the ballot and voted down is that not a right granted by the constitution? Beside there is nothing in the Bible that tells us not to drink alcohol. It states that the person who is a drunk is a fool. Also if you look at laws you will get a real kick out of some of the out dated laws still on the books. In my job I had to swear that I had not fought a duel,outdated much?

        The only objection that I am aware of is Islam. Islam is not a religion it is a scourge. All Americans with their eyes open and brains working do not want them here. They did not come here to escape any conditions in their country and become American. They came here to conquer. They are not tolerant of any one that is not Muslin. They obey Sharia law. As a female that is and obscenity. We are infidels to be made slaves a destroyed. Do not come to America and expect to change her, you are not welcome. Come here for our way of life,you are welcome. If not, go back to where our way of life does not offend you and you fit in. As Christians we have no desire to come to your country and force you into anything. Christians are not changing the laws. They are trying to keep the right to protect themselves.

        The next thing you will probably say is that we have traveled to other countries with religion. The Bible states that the gospel is to be preached to all the world to fulfill prophecy. That has been done. If some people in history have overstepped their authority it is on their heads to answer for their own transgressions. The intent was never to force. How many instances can you reference of Christians beheading someone or stoning women or throwing acid in their face. Shooting them for wanting and education or honor killing? Look to you Muslin Brotherhood for those headlines.

  2. I don’t know of radical Christians calling for the death of non believers at this time in history. I know they are pro life and anti gay marriage but i think the laws passed of late have protect both.

  3. Simple: break this eternal bound between US Admin. and Saudi Arabia. A little nuclear tactical bomb on Mekah will end this problem once and for ever. Saudi Arabia is the one responsible for exporting Jihadi idiology of Islam, as well as supporting terrorists with the huge money it provides with the American and French support

  4. Every American that stands for “tolerance” of ALL religions needs to understand religious freedom can never supersede fundamental constitutional freedom (life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness). If we allow that we can allow anything–including infiltration of those seeking our decimation–all under the guise of “religious freedom”.

    The Constitution can only offer protection for religions that are accordant with the fundamental rights (life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness) of the Constitution otherwise the Constitution could actually offer protection to a religion that sets itself up to destroy the Constitution. That would be self-defeating. It’s absurd to think that our founders would frame our Constitution, in all its genius, in such a self-defeating way.

    So the argument goes something like this:

    P1: The Constitution cannot be self-defeating (i.e. if The Constitution was self-defeating, we would have no objective and legitimate point of reference for our Civil rights).

    P2: It would be nonsensical and self-defeating for the Constitution to offer protection to religions that could/would destroy the Constitution.

    P3: The Constitution is to protect religious freedom for religions that are compatible with the Constitution; more specifically, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. After all, these are fundamental rights that cannot be taken away by any religion.

    P4: If any so called “religion” does not respect the fundamental rights outlined in our Constitution then that religion does not get the protection of that Constitution. In other words, the religion has delegitimized itself from the Constitution and any rights that come from the Constitution.

    P5: Islam does not respect the fundamental rights outlined in our Constitution.

    Conclusion: Therefore, Islam has delegitimized itself from the Constitution and any rights that come from the Constitution.

  5. The progression of Muslims in any country can be summed up like this:

    1. Where there are few Muslims they are quiet.

    2. Where there are many Muslims they are demanding.

    3. Where there are a majority of Muslims they are forceful/ controlling.

    Furthermore, there are two classes of people in Islam—the Muslim and the infidel. The infidel does not get the same rights and privileges as the Muslim. And what about women’s rights? Women in Islam do not share the same rights as men. These ideals are in direct conflict to our country’s principles of “All men are created equal.”

    Look at what happened to Lebanon, what is happening in the U.K. and the rest of Europe.

    If Islam is to be categorized as a religion – then it must be called what it truthfully is – a religion of war. Unfortunately our leadership has become so inept, they have chosen to be in denial of this obvious fact, and entertain fanciful notions – that by calling a “blood thirsty tiger” a “bunny rabbit” it will magically transform into one.

    To put it bluntly Islam’s religion status should be rescinded because it is a wolf in sheep’s clothing, a Trojan horse, an imposter religion that has arrived on our shore with malicious intent, deathly determined to replace our constitution with the Koran, and turn America into an Islamic nation controlled by Sharia law.

      • Wrong. Obviously you’ve not read the New Testament. No genuine Christian, a follower of Christ, would ever try to convert anyone to Christianity by force.

      • The “no true scottsman” logical fallacy. You don’t get to decide who’s a “real” Christian, anymore than you get to decide who’s a real Muslim. Christianity is kept in check only by the constitution and laws.

      • I’m not the one who has clearly laid out the criteria by which anyone can make a judgment about whether or not a person is a genuine Christian, or a genuine Muslim. Both the Bible…the authority for Christianity, and the Quran/haddith/Sunna….the authorites for Islam…..tell us how one can know if someone is a true Christian or a Muslim.

        As I said before, Christianity and Islam are polar opposites but you continue to deliberately misrepresent Christianity.

        That sinful things have been done in the name of Jesus, is clear from history. But when a Christian commits an heinous act, it is in contradiction to Christ’s teachings and reveals that the person is a counterfeit, and was not a disciple of Christ.

        When a Muslim wages jihad against innocents, its in keeping with Islamic teaching, an obligatory act rewarded by allah.

        Since you keep saying that these two religions are equally violent and to be despised, it’s clear that either you are speaking out of total ignorance, or deliberately lying.

      • Christians systematically brutalized native races before the constitution ever existed. I’m sorry you’re having trouble with that idea.

        The constitution disarms Christian theocracy.

      • That’s funny, considering the US Constitution, Bill of Rights and the overwhelming majority of state constitutions and laws were originally built upon the truths of God’s Word.

      • I think you need to read more quotes from our founders.

        Here’s what John Adams had to say about your invented “secular” constitution (EMPHASIS ADDED):

        “We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion [i.e. secularism]. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry [i.e. the logical outworkings of secularism] would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution WAS MADE ONLY FOR A MORAL AND RELIGIOUS PEOPLE. IT IS WHOLLY INADEQUATE TO THE GOVERNMENT OF ANY OTHER.”–John Adams (The Works of John Adams, ed. C. F. Adams, Boston: Little, Brown Co., 1851, 4:31)

        Have you ever stopped to consider what “religion” John Adams was referring to when he referred to the “moral and religious people” our Constitution was made for? Maybe Islam? I can’t find any quotes from our Muslim foundering fathers. Buddhism? I can’t find any quotes from our Buddhist founding fathers. Hinduism? Paganism? Sikhism? Atheism/secularism? No, no, no, and no. There is one religion in particular that is referenced and acknowledged over and over from our founders as the undergirding of our Constitution, laws, education, and freedom–that religion is CHRISTIANITY and CHRISTIANITY only! Anyone who denies or excuses the evidence of this fact from the following quotes is suffering from a classic case of cognitive dissonance:

        “Without morals a republic cannot subsist any length of time; they therefore who are decrying the Christian religion, whose morality is so sublime and pure (and) which insures to the good eternal happiness, are undermining the solid foundation of morals, the best security for the duration of free governments.”–Charles Carroll, signer of the Declaration of Independence

        “It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded asylum, prosperity, and freedom of worship here.” –Patrick Henry

        “Finally, let us not forget the religious character of our origin. Our fathers were brought hither by their high veneration for the Christian religion. They journeyed by its light, and labored in its hope. They sought to incorporate its principles with the elements of their society, and to diffuse its influence through all their institutions, civil, political, or literary.” –Daniel Webster

        “The religion which has introduced civil liberty is the religion of Christ and His apostles, which enjoins humility, piety, and benevolence; which acknowledges in every person a brother, or a sister, and a citizen with equal rights. This is genuine Christianity, and to this we owe our free Constitutions of Government.” –Noah Webster (Webster’s Dictionary was named after him), has been called the “Father of American Scholarship and Education.”

        “Christianity is the only true and perfect religion, and that in proportion as mankind adopts its principles and obeys its precepts, they will be wise and happy.
        In contemplating the political institutions of the United States, I lament that we waste so much time and money in punishing crimes and take so little pains to prevent them. We profess to be republicans, and yet we neglect the only means of establishing and perpetuating our republican forms of government, that is, the universal education of our youth in the principles of Christianity by the means of the Bible.
        For this Divine book, above all others, favors that equality among mankind, that respect for just laws, and those sober and frugal virtues, which constitute the soul of republicanism.”–Benjamin Rush, member of the Continental Congress, 1776-77, and signed the Declaration of Independence.

      • Let me show you with whom I agree. My response will be very simple, so that even you can understand.

        “The christian religion is a parody on the worship of the Sun, in which they put a man whom they call Christ, in the place of the Sun, and pay him the same adoration which was originally paid to the Sun.”
        ~Thomas Paine, founding father

      • As for the Thomas Paine quotes (or Ethan Allen for that matter), he may have been hostile to evangelical Christianity, but he was a firebrand of the Revolution, not an intellectual architect of the Constitution. Paine didn’t arrive in this country until 1774 and only stayed a short time.

        As for others–George Washington, Samuel Adams, James Madison, John Witherspoon, Alexander Hamilton, John Jay, John Adams, Patrick Henry, and even Thomas Jefferson–their personal correspondence, biographies, and public statements are replete with quotations showing that these thinkers had political philosophies deeply influenced by Christianity.

        The phrase “Founding Fathers or Framers” refers to a specific group of men, the 55 delegates to the Constitutional Convention. There were other important players not in attendance, like Jefferson, whose thinking deeply influenced the shaping of our nation. These 55 Founding Fathers, though, made up the core.

        The denominational affiliations of these men were a matter of public record. Among the delegates were 28 Episcopalians, 8 Presbyterians, 7 Congregationalists, 2 Lutherans, 2 Dutch Reformed, 2 Methodists, 2 Roman Catholics, 1 unknown, and only 3 deists–Williamson, Wilson, and Franklin–this at a time when church membership entailed a sworn public confession of biblical faith. [John Eidsmoe, Christianity and the Constitution, (Grand Rapids: Baker, 1987), p. 43.]

        This shows that the members of the Constitutional Convention, the most influential group of men shaping the political foundations of our nation, were almost all Christians, 51 of 55–a full 93%. Indeed, 70% were Calvinists (the Episcopalians, Presbyterians, and the Dutch Reformed), considered by some to be the most extreme and dogmatic form of Christianity

      • In other words, any writings of the 55 delegates to the “Constitutional” Convention, i.e., Founding Fathers (especially if they were Christian) should be dismissed as nonsense and irrelevant to our “Constitution”. However, the writings of someone who was NOT an intellectual architect of the Constitution should be held in high esteem and revered for all its wisdom and insight? As Spock would say, “FASCINATING!”

      • You said all that, not me. The truth of Christianity’s history has nothing to do with the personal beliefs of the founders.

        You’re putting words in others’ mouths and producing wild presumptions. That’s all on you. A wildly religious tendency.

      • Even the Deists and Pantheists owned beliefs better suited to reflecting the true nature of reality. Christianity is a pagan farce religion. Every time you “pray”, you’re praying to the Jewish cult equivalent of Mars, to the sun, and celebrating human sacrifice.

        Good going.

      • I am taking your statement, “Let me show you with whom I agree [Thomas Paine]”. To its logical conclusion, i.e. “reductio ad absurdum”. As you can see, it’s a pretty ridiculous conclusion. It’s not surprising that you are backing away. I accept your apology 😉

      • That must be your serious reply to all answers you don’t like. How the notion that Thomas Paine and Thomas Jefferson “had it right” is somehow “reducto ad absurdum” merely because history backs their opinion is beyond me.

        In any case, America is a Deist country, at best.

      • FYI The phrase “Founding Fathers or Framers” refers to a specific group of men, the 55 delegates to the Constitutional Convention. There were other important players not in attendance, like Jefferson, whose thinking deeply influenced the shaping of our nation. These 55 Founding Fathers, though, made up the core.

        Again, Thomas Paine was a firebrand of the Revolution, not an intellectual architect of the Constitution. Therefore, he was not a “founding father”.

      • Thomas Paine knew the truth of Christianity’s history, and anything else you just included is meaningless. It matters not what anyone else believed. Christianity is a LIE.

      • As for the Thomas Paine quotes (or Ethan Allen for that matter), he may have been hostile to evangelical Christianity, but he was a firebrand of the Revolution, not an intellectual architect of the Constitution. Paine didn’t arrive in this country until 1774 and only stayed a short time.

        As for others–George Washington, Samuel Adams, James Madison, John Witherspoon, Alexander Hamilton, John Jay, John Adams, Patrick Henry, and even Thomas Jefferson–their personal correspondence, biographies, and public statements are replete with quotations showing that these thinkers had political philosophies deeply influenced by Christianity.

        The phrase “Founding Fathers or Framers” refers to a specific group of men, the 55 delegates to the Constitutional Convention. There were other important players not in attendance, like Jefferson, whose thinking deeply influenced the shaping of our nation. These 55 Founding Fathers, though, made up the core.

        The denominational affiliations of these men were a matter of public record. Among the delegates were 28 Episcopalians, 8 Presbyterians, 7 Congregationalists, 2 Lutherans, 2 Dutch Reformed, 2 Methodists, 2 Roman Catholics, 1 unknown, and only 3 deists–Williamson, Wilson, and Franklin–this at a time when church membership entailed a sworn public confession of biblical faith. [John Eidsmoe, Christianity and the Constitution, (Grand Rapids: Baker, 1987), p. 43.]

        This shows that the members of the Constitutional Convention, the most influential group of men shaping the political foundations of our nation, were almost all Christians, 51 of 55–a full 93%. Indeed, 70% were Calvinists (the Episcopalians, Presbyterians, and the Dutch Reformed), considered by some to be the most extreme and dogmatic form of Christianity.

      • You said, “Christianity is a LIE”>>> What exactly about Christianity is a lie and how did you come to that conclusion?

      • The Bible is not somehow “inerrant”, it is full of internal and factual inconsistencies, the Jewish cult deity of the Torah does not exist, faith healing and “miracles” are scams, churches serve wealthy pastors with Maybach Benzes and mansions, religion in general is a pyramid scheme of social control, and the “Afterlife” is fairytale, along with everything else in the Bible beyond historical fact.

        The Bible is the product of Roman councils, Christianity is only around because it was a Roman religion and was almost replaced by the nearly identical religion of Mithraism.

        There is nothing special about Christianity, and people who claim otherwise are the least attractive people I have ever met.

        I have vast personal experience with this fraud. I escaped the cult. This makes me very proud, and happy, and fulfilled.

      • If you thought I was implying our country was “founded upon the Christian religion (i.e. established to be some sort of Christian theocracy), then you are mistaken. Our founders did NOT want to establish and live under another theocracy that would tell them how to pray, how to worship, how to tithe—basically, how to live!

        What I said was “the undergirding of our Constitution, laws, education, and freedom is Christianity.”

      • The majority happened to be Christian. The U.S. is also Deist and Pantheist, if you want to play it that way.

        I wonder what the Deist founder would have to say about your assertion.

      • Many people that deny the faith of our founders build up a straw man (“You believe the framers wanted a Christian theocracy) and then knock it down. I don’t want to waste our time with straw men, so why don’t I paint a picture of our founders and you can tell me which parts you disagree with and why:

        • Virtually all those involved in the founding enterprise were God-fearing men in the Christian sense; most were Calvinistic Protestants.

        • The Founders were deeply influenced by a biblical view of man and government. With a sober understanding of the fallenness of man, they devised a system of limited authority and checks and balances.

        • The Founders understood that fear of God, moral leadership, and a righteous citizenry were necessary for their great experiment to succeed.

        • Therefore, they structured a political climate that was encouraging to Christianity and accommodating to religion, rather than hostile to it—The First Amendment was to protect the church from the State, not the other way around.

        • Protestant Christianity was the prevailing religious view for the first 150 years of our history.

        • They specifically prohibited the establishment of Christianity—or any other faith—as the religion of our nation. They did not want to live under another theocracy that would tell them how to pray, how to worship, how to tithe—basically, how to live!

        However…

        • The Fathers sought to set up a just society, NOT a Christian THEOCRACY. In order to have a just society you need a justice system (just laws). This is where the whole idea of “separation of church and state”—the way it is interpreted today (making sure any government agency or agent is not influenced AT ALL by any religion at all)—breaks down. Consider the following:

        James Wilson was one of the framers of our Constitution (described as “The Architect of the Constitution”).

        • One of only six individuals to sign both the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution.

        • Spoke on the floor of the Convention 168 times. He was the second most active member of the Constitutional Convention (he was very active in framing the Constitution.

        • One of six justices appointed by George Washington to the first Supreme Court.

        • First law professor and founder of the Penn Law School.

        James Wilson had this to say about law:

        “All (laws), however, may be arranged in two different classes. 1) Divine. 2) Human…But it should always be remembered that this law, natural or revealed, made for men or for nations, flows from the same Divine source: it is the law of God…Human law must rest its authority ultimately upon the authority of that law which is Divine.” James Wilson 1804, [Works of the Honorable James Wilson,1804, Vol. 1, pp103-105, “Of the General principles of Law and Obligation.”]

        Basically he was saying: ““You cannot have good civil law if it’s not based on DIVINE law.” This is why many of our laws were laws that reflected biblical values.

        Alexander Hamilton: “The law…dictated by God Himself is, of course, superior in obligation to any other. It is binding over all the globe, in all countries, and at all times. No human laws are of any validity if contrary to this.” Alexander Hamilton Feb 23, 1775 [The Papers of Alexander Hamilton, Vol. 1, p. 87, Feb. 23, 1775]

        Noah Webster(America’s school master, Author of 1st American English Dictionary, authored Art. 1 Section 8 of U.S. Constitution) : “[The] ‘Law of nature’ is a rule of conduct arising out of the natural relations of human beings established by the Creator and existing prior to any positive precept (human law)…these…have been established by the Creator and are, with a peculiar felicity of expression, denominated in Scripture, “ordinances of heaven.” [ p. 470, Noah Webster, An American Dictionary of the English Language 1828, “law,” definition #3 & #6]

      • I’m only interested in what was correctly factually attributed to historical Christianity, namely, that it is a mock religion built from the scraps of sun-god worship and paganism.

        I am also interested in the separation of government and religion.

        Any other opinions by any of the other founders matter little to me. I’m with Jefferson and Paine.

      • So do you believe the person of Jesus Christ was invented? Do you believe the the disciples of Christ existed? Who do you believe wrote the Gospels? Who is the apostle Paul?

      • I believe Jesus was a real person. I also believe in Dionysus, Mithra, Horus, Attis, and Krishna. Do I really believe in them as their religious followers do? Nope.

        There are authors of the gospels, but they could never get their stories straight, and a Roman council decided which books stayed, and which books to discard. Poor choices by the council all around. The book of Enoch is fascinating.

      • Enoch is fascinating, but that doesn’t mean it should be included. The bible wasn’t meant to merely be “fascinating”.
        Even though the Bible is made up of 66 different books written by 40 different authors over 1600 years, we find incredible (Supernatural) unity and harmony.
        The book of Enoch is full of false doctrine that contradicts many parts of the bible. Many ostensible contradictions in the bible are in fact not contradictions but paradoxes. Not so with the book of Enoch. The contradictions in the book of Enoch cannot be ratified with the rest of Scripture.
        Here is a good article on thus subject:
        http://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/8576/why-is-the-book-of-enoch-not-regarded-as-canonical

      • The rest of scripture cannot be reconciled with the rest of scripture. That’s because not only is it a set of different authors with different accounts, but Roman councils (consisting of men) put it together in aggregation. Even if King James’ “translation” hadn’t been so seriously biased and flawed, the internal inconsistencies in the Bible would be grave.

        Don’t make me start pulling them out one by one.
        There is nothing supernatural about the Bible. In fact, there is nothing supernatural about anything, and the fact that the world is the way it exists isn’t proof, but definitely a statistical hindrance, to “Yahweh”, the god of the Jewish cult’s, existence. God is either evil, apathetic, or not omnipotent.

      • Yes, I have lumped both reality and the Bible together as evidence that God is absent from both, leaving them derelict.

      • You said, “they could never get their stories straight.”>>> Detectives expect slight variations in eye witness testimony otherwise there is good reason to suspect collusion. If the early church fathers were trying to fabricate a lie why wouldn’t they just change the text so that every account was identical and avoid all the future skepticism surrounding any variations? The most plausible answer is that integrity of the Scriptures was of the utmost concern.

        There are many other FACTS that just don’t comport with the conspiracy theory of Christianity springing into existence from a LIE.

        Not enough time had passed from the time they were written for a legend to be plausible—F.F. Bruce, professor of biblical criticism puts it this way, “Had there been any tendency to depart from the facts in any material respect, the possible presence of hostile witnesses in the audience would have served as a further corrective.”

        Skeptics need to provide PLAUSIBLE explanations to these well established facts about Jesus.

        Historical Facts:

        #1 After his crucifixion Jesus was buried by Joseph of Arimathea in a tomb.

        –this is an important fact, otherwise anyone could just say, “Jesus was never buried”

        –also, if the burial story is accurate, then the location of Jesus’ tomb was known and the claims of the disciples could have been easily cross examined.

         

        #2 Jesus’ empty tomb—On the Sunday after the crucifixion, Jesus’ tomb was found empty by a group of his women followers.

        –Scholars have concluded this as fact based on:

        a. The empty tomb is also multiply attested by independent, early sources (Mark, Matthew, John, Acts, implied by Paul’s first letter to the Corinthian Church).

        b. Embarrassing Testimony:  The tomb was discovered empty by women. The testimony of women was not highly regarded during that time (women weren’t even permitted to serve as witnesses in a Jewish court of law)

        –any legendary account would have made males discover the tomb to provide credibility to the story.

        c. The disciples of Christ did not go off to Athens or Rome to preach that Christ was raised from the dead. Rather, they went right back to the city of Jerusalem, where, if what they were teaching was false, the falsity would be evident. The empty tomb was “too notorious to be denied.” Paul Althaus states that the resurrection “could have not been maintained in Jerusalem for a single day, for a single hour, if the emptiness of the tomb had not been established as a fact for all concerned.”

        d. Both Jewish and Roman sources and traditions admit an empty tomb. Those resources range from Josephus to a compilation of fifth-century Jewish writings called the “Toledoth Jeshu.” Dr. Paul Maier calls this “positive evidence from a hostile source, which is the strongest kind of historical evidence. In essence, this means that if a source admits a fact decidedly not in its favor, then that fact is genuine.”

        #3 Eyewitness Testimony:  Jesus appears alive after his death—On different occasions and under various circumstances different individuals and groups of people experienced appearances of Jesus alive from the dead.

        Acts 2:32—“This Jesus God has raised up, of which we are all witnesses.”

        The writers not only said, “Look, we saw this or we heard that…,” but they turned the tables around and right in front of their most adverse critics said, “You also know about these things…You saw them.”

        Acts 2:22—“Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a Man attested by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs which God did through Him in your midst, as you yourselves also know…” (Remember, the strong point F.F. Bruce made: “Had there been any tendency to depart from the facts in any material respect, the possible presence of hostile witnesses in the audience would have served as a further corrective”).

        a. Jesus appeared to Peter, the 12 disciples, 500 people at once, to His younger brother James (who, up to that time, was apparently not a believer), and to Paul who at the time was still a persecutor of Christians.

        Common objection–Jesus was seen alive after His death and burial only by His friends and followers (they saw what they wanted to see). Using that argument, they attempt to water down the overwhelming impact of the multiple eyewitness accounts. Was Saul of Tarsus a follower of Christ? The facts show the exact opposite. Saul despised Christ and persecuted Christ’s followers.

        #4 The origin of the disciples’ belief in his resurrection.—The original disciples suddenly and sincerely came to believe that Jesus was risen from the dead even though their Jewish heritage should have slanted their beliefs the other way.

        As H.D.A Major explains, “Had the crucifixion of Jesus ended His disciples’ experience of Him, it is hard to see how the Christian church could have come into existence. That church was founded on faith in the Messiahship of Jesus. A crucified Messiah was no messiah at all. He was the one rejected by Judaism and accursed of God.”

        Think of the situation the disciples faced following Jesus’ crucifixion. Their leader was dead! The disciples were all Jewish (they had beliefs, they had religion, and they had a tradition). There was nothing in the Jewish tradition about a messiah that would be shamefully executed as a criminal. (This idea would have literally been invented out of nowhere). Jewish beliefs on the afterlife had nothing about anyone rising from the dead to glory and immortality BEFORE the general resurrection of the dead at the end of the world.

        –The original disciples suddenly came to believe, nevertheless, so strongly that God had raised Jesus from the dead that they were willing to die for that belief. What in the world caused them to believe such an unJewish/outlandish thing, and spread the message of the risen Christ?

        No one has ever explained how the idea of Jesus’ resurrection would even occur to anyone if it hadn’t actually happened.

        Excruciating Testimony:  Had there been any visible benefits accrued to them from their efforts–prestige, wealth, increased social status or material benefits–we might logically attempt to account for their actions, for their whole-hearted and total allegiance to this “risen Christ.” As a reward for their efforts, however, those early Christians were beaten, stoned to death, thrown to the lions, tortured and crucified. Every conceivable method was used to stop them from talking.

        Common objection—people die for things they believe in all the time (suicide bombers). Exactly, so these disciples would not have died horrendous deaths for something they knew to be a lie!

        Conclusion: The only reason to deny the historical reliability of the Greek manuscripts and form some outlandish conspiracy theories of the life and resurrection of Jesus is a philosophical (anti-supernatural bias) one, not a historical one.

        Many critics and skeptics throughout history have sought out to disprove the life and claims of Jesus. All have failed in their attempts. In fact many are so overwhelmed by the mountain of evidence that they realize it would take more faith to remain an atheist/agnostic than to believe and receive Jesus in their heart.

      • All sources should be external to the Bible. “Facts” in the bible cited by self-reason suffer from circular reasoning; “this book is factually correct because it says it is factually correct.” Wrong.

        Since you want to to get nitty gritty:

        1.) Okay, sure. Not all that important. People are buried all the time.

        2.) It was empty. So what?
        a. Self-referential evidence does not count. Circular logic.
        b. There is no evidence that men could not have done this, and the Bible’s saying that women did it is of no consequence, because the Bible is not a credible source of its own factuality. That is self-reference.
        c. Or, it just never happened, and this is what the Jews themselves seem to think. I think I agree with their account, rather like Egyptian history holds no record of any flood, because that also never happened.
        d. See “biblical accounts”. The “resurrection is well-known as a myth, as it was in similar religions, Josephus or not.
        Since you bring up the Toledot Jeshu, I’m sure you also agree with this account:
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toledot_Yeshu#Strassburg_Manuscript
        I love the idea of Jesus and Judas engaging in aerial warfare. Fantastic. Lends it real factual credibility.
        “The stories claim that Jesus was an illegitimate child, and that he practiced magic and heresy, seduced women, and died a shameful death.”

        3.) Where is this eyewitness testimony? In the Bible?
        Doesn’t count. That’s self-reference.

        4.) The resurrection and belief in it by twelve disciples is not unique to Christianity, and is in fact predated by the cult of Horus, a very Christ-like figure.

        Christianity survived the same way all religions survive; people will believe anything they are told, and accept it because of authority. Several religions that predate Christianity are still alive for that reason.

        “The only reason to deny the historical reliability of the Greek manuscripts and form some outlandish conspiracy theories of the life and resurrection of Jesus is a philosophical (anti-supernatural bias) one, not a historical one.”

        Exactly. No-one denies Jesus’ historical existence. It’s the claims that Jesus floated up into the clouds or walked on water that prove the Bible is a book of myths. Nothing else needs to be “disproven”. Religion is anti-science, not being based on logical reasoning, and is not meant to be taken literally. Only the gullible would do that.

      • You said, “All sources should be external to the Bible.” Says who? You? Who made you the arbiter of what is considered evidence?

        The problem with the way you present your argument throughout your entire response is you kept referring to, “the Bible, the Bible, the Bible.” The reason this is a problem is because you have already decided (from the accounts of miracles within the bible) that everything in the bible must be ignored as unreliable, fallacious, and mythological in nature. Remember circular reasoning is when the reasoner begins with what they are trying to prove. The thing we are trying to prove is whether God exists or not and miracles have happened or not.

        Now to be clear, I am NOT saying, “GOD exists because the bible says so, and we can trust the bible because it is the Word of God.” That is circular reasoning. I am saying, “Let’s look at some of the other evidence/ claims in the Bible to see how credible the authors are; therefore, we can make an inference to the best explanation of the facts regarding the supernatural claims (i.e. God and miracles) within the Bible.

        But notice what you have said, “It’s the claims that Jesus floated up into the clouds or walked on water that PROVE the Bible is a book of myths.” You statement here is implying, “We know the bible is false because it says God exists / performs miracles, and we know God doesn’t exist / perform miracles.” Remember whether God exists and performs miracles is the very thing in question and you have asserted the conclusion (i.e. God does not exist and miracles do not happen) from the start. This is a clear case example of circular reasoning and if you can’t see it, please take this conversation to your nearest logician or professor.

        “Facts” in the bible cited by self-reason suffer from circular reasoning; “this book is factually correct because it says it is factually correct.” >>> It would be circular reasoning if the reason I accepted what the bible says as true was “because the bible says it is true”. I never said or implied that so please don’t waste our time repeating that straw man. There are historical and archaeological FACTS that have been investigated and confirmed because of the accounts recorded by New Testament authors that stand alone on their own historical reliability and lend credence to the author’s accounts. If you treated the New Testament manuscripts like any other works of antiquity (e.g. Plato, Aristotle, Julius Caesar, etc.) you would consider it a credible reference point for history.

        When we read the account of Luke, it is clearly not written like a fairy tale (i.e. “once upon a time…”).

        The famous skeptic, historian, and archeologist, Sir William Ramsay spent 15 years trying to discredit the New Testament. Ramsay was very skeptical of the accuracy of the New Testament, and he ventured to Asia minor over a century ago to refute its historicity. He especially took interest in Luke’s accounts in the Gospel of Luke and the Book of Acts, which contained numerous geographical and historic references. Dig after dig the evidence without fail supported Luke’s accounts. Governors mentioned by Luke that many historians never believe existed were confirmed by the evidence excavated by Ramsay’s archeological team. Without a single error, Luke was accurate in naming 32 countries, 54 cities, and 9 islands. Ramsay became so overwhelmed with the evidence he eventually converted to Christianity. Ramsay finally had this to say:

        “I began with a mind unfavorable to it…but more recently I found myself brought into contact with the Book of Acts as an authority for the topography, antiquities, and society of Asia Minor. It was gradually borne upon me that in various details the narrative showed marvelous truth.

        Luke is a historian of the first rank; not merely are his statements of fact trustworthy…this author should be placed along with the very greatest historian.”

        http://www.bibleevidences.com/archeology.htm

        Additionally, I wonder if the co-founder of Harvard Law School would agree with your cavalier dismissal (e.g. “all sources should be external to the bible”) of the New Testament manuscripts as evidence.

        Dr. Greenleaf, the Royal Professor of Law at Harvard University, was one of the greatest legal minds that ever lived. He wrote the famous legal volume entitled, A Treatise on the Law of Evidence, considered by many the greatest legal volume ever written.

        Dr. Greenleaf took his 3 volumes on the Laws of Legal Evidence and applied those principles to the resurrection of Christ. After thoroughly examining the evidence for the resurrection — He wrote a book entitled, An Examination of the Testimony of the Four Evangelists by the Rules of Evidence Administered in the Courts of Justice. In which he emphatically stated:

        “it was IMPOSSIBLE that the apostles could have persisted in affirming the truths they had narrated, had not JESUS CHRIST ACTUALLY RISEN FROM THE DEAD, . . .” (Simon Greenleaf, An Examination of the Testimony of the Four Evangelists by the Rules of Evidence Administered in the Courts of Justice, p.29).

        Greenleaf concluded that according to the jurisdiction of legal evidence the resurrection of Jesus Christ was the best supported event in all of history! And not only that, Dr. Greenleaf was so convinced by the overwhelming evidence, he committed his life to Jesus Christ!

        The fact that the Christian worldview is verifiable sets it apart from all other ‘man made religions’

        This is why the co-founder of Harvard Law school could take his 3 volumes on the Laws of Legal Evidence and apply those principles to the basis, and grounding of Christianity—the resurrection of Christ. Could Dr. Greenleaf take his volumes on the Laws of Legal Evidence and apply them to Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism, Sikhism, or any other religion? I don’t think so!

        You said, “It was empty. So what?”>>>So what? There are not that many options here and we are looking for the most plausible answer without presupposing anything.

        b. There is no evidence that men could not have done this, and the Bible’s saying that women did it is of no consequence, because the Bible is not a credible source of its own factuality. That is self-reference.>>>Why would you self-reference something EMBARRASSING?

        Women’s testimony was not regarded highly (Lk. 24:11).

        i. “Any evidence which a woman [gives] is not valid (to offer), also they are not valid to offer. This is equivalent to saying that one who is Rabbinically accounted a robber is qualified to give the same evidence as a woman” (Talmud, Rosh Hashannah 1.8).

        ii. “But let not the testimony of women be admitted, on account of the levity and boldness of their sex, nor let servants be admitted to give testimony on account of the ignobility of their soul; since it is probable that they may not speak truth, either out of hope of gain, or fear of punishment” (Josephus, Antiquities, 4.8.15).

        iii. “Sooner let the words of the Law be burnt than delivered to women” (Talmud, Sotah 19a)

        http://carm.org/did-jesus-rise-dead-outline

        c. You said, “Or, it just never happened, and this is what the Jews themselves seem to think”>>>What never happened—the crucifixion or being buried in a tomb? If it’s the burial you don’t believe in, then again, I go back to the women as witnesses. If you are going to make up a story, why would you have women whose testimony was considered half of a man’s?

        You said, “Where is this eyewitness testimony? In the Bible?

        Doesn’t count. That’s self-reference.>>> Again, your dismissal is based on some philosophical bias against “THE BIBLE.” Instead of referring to “the Bible” why don’t you refer to the actual author. For example, where is this eyewitness testimony? From MATTHEW? If you don’t have a good reason to discredit Matthew as a credible source other than your anti-supernatural bias, then any dismissal amounts to nothing more than circular reasoning.

        Furthermore, you will only accept eyewitness testimony from someone who was not a “believer in Christ (as Lord).” Think about that for a second. If someone witnessed Jesus Christ resurrected but was not a believer, then you would consider that as evidence? How could someone NOT believe if they saw what the disciples saw—A MIRACLE!! In other words, you have stacked the deck so that no possible evidence could ever come forward that could dethrone your position as your own god.

        You said, “The resurrection and belief in it by twelve disciples is not unique to Christianity.., people will believe anything they are told, and accept it because of authority..>>> I just want to be clear. Is it your belief that the authors of the gospels and the disciples were merely “told” about Jesus Christ? When do you think the gospels were written? You haven’t thought this out very well. If Jesus had not been resurrected, the disciples would have known it. People will not die for something they know to be a lie. The fact that all of the apostles were willing to die horrible deaths, refusing to renounce their faith in Christ, is tremendous evidence that they had truly witnessed the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

        You said, “Exactly. No-one denies Jesus’ historical existence. It’s the claims that Jesus floated up into the clouds or walked on water that prove the Bible is a book of myths…>>>

        The bottom line here is that no amount of evidence can match your infinite capacity for skepticism. I’ve had these discussions before and the further we press down the corridor of truth the more the conversation devolves into nothing more than the childish antics of “how do you know, how do you know, how do you know, on and on ad infinitum). The only reason you dismiss anything contained in the bible as factual is because the bible claims miracles. Since you have already concluded miracles are not possible because of your a priori commitment to the naturalistic worldview, you in fact are the one guilty of circular reasoning.

        Perhaps the following will demonstrate how ironic it truly is for you to charge me with circular reasoning:

        Atheist: Miracles are not possible because there is no “evidence” for them.

        Believer: Doesn’t The New Testament manuscripts record testimony (i.e. “evidence”) of many people that witnessed miracles performed by Jesus?

        Atheist: That doesn’t count as “evidence”.

        Believer: Why not?

        Atheist: Because miracles are not possible

        Believer: Do you believe in the “Big Bang”?

        Atheist: Yes

        Believer: A miracle is described as an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers. Is it just me or doesn’t that sound like an apt description of the Big Bang?

        Atheist: You’re an idiot!

        Do you see the problem with this conversation? The blatant circular reasoning by the atheist–the atheist (reasoned) begins (miracles are not possible because there is no God) with what they are trying to end with (there is no God; therefore miracles are not possible, the bible is not true, and therefore, anybody who believes the bible is “gullible”/an idiot!). All the while, completely ignoring or oblivious to the biggest, most obvious miracle of all–THE BIG BANG!

      • I’m the arbiter of nothing. Obviously. I’m going by what is generally considered good evidence, and self-reference in a work is not evidence at all. All good evidence FOR the bible should be external to it, yes. Otherwise, all works that claim themselves as true and factually correct are logically true.

        “The problem with the way you present your argument throughout your entire response is you kept referring to, “the Bible, the Bible, the Bible.” ”
        I did that only because the comments to which I was responding were nothing but references to the Bible. Obviously, pointing out circular reasoning is NOT circular reasoning on my part.

        “Remember circular reasoning is when the reasoner begins with what they are trying to prove. The thing we are trying to prove is whether God exists or not and miracles have happened or not.”
        Yes, so maybe you could kindly refrain from doing that.
        I’m not trying to prove whether or not God exists. It is very improbable that he does, but no, I’m not trying to prove he doesn’t. Just like I can’t prove that leprechauns don’t exist.

        “Now to be clear, I am NOT saying, “GOD exists because the bible says so, and we can trust the bible because it is the Word of God.” ”
        Yes, actually, you did imply just that by using the Bible as evidence for content within itself.

        “”Facts” in the bible cited by self-reason suffer from circular reasoning; “this book is factually correct because it says it is factually correct.” >>> It would be circular reasoning if the reason I accepted what the bible says as true was “because the bible says it is true”. I never said or implied that so please don’t waste our time repeating that straw man”.
        Actually, yes, you did. You said, “a. The empty tomb is also multiply attested by independent, early sources (Mark, Matthew, John, Acts, implied by Paul’s first letter to the Corinthian Church).”

        That is self reference.

        “Again, your dismissal is based on some philosophical bias against “THE BIBLE.” Instead of referring to “the Bible” why don’t you refer to the actual author. For example, where is this eyewitness testimony? From MATTHEW? If you don’t have a good reason to discredit Matthew as a credible source other than your anti-supernatural bias, then any dismissal amounts to nothing more than circular reasoning.”

        No, citing Matthew is citing Biblical content, changed and adulterated over centuries, which is using the Bible as evidence for itself. It has nothing to do with bias.

        “You haven’t thought this out very well. If Jesus had not been resurrected, the disciples would have known it. People will not die for something they know to be a lie. The fact that all of the apostles were willing to die horrible deaths, refusing to renounce their faith in Christ, is tremendous evidence that they had truly witnessed the resurrection of Jesus Christ.”

        What is there to think about? There are religions predating Christianity that contain the same savior myths. I don’t care if fools die for myths, in a cult. No-one think their precious beliefs are lies. That’s precisely why they believe them, and then die for them. Jesus is a carbon copy mythical figure, based on a real person, attributed the mythic deeds of his fictional forbears.

        “What never happened—the crucifixion or being buried in a tomb? If it’s the burial you don’t believe in, then again, I go back to the women as witnesses. If you are going to make up a story, why would you have women whose testimony was considered half of a man’s?”

        Jesus floating up into the clouds, of course. There is no reliable documentation for this, other than the Bible itself, which would be self reference.

        ” I’ve had these discussions before and the further we press down the corridor of truth the more the conversation devolves into nothing more than the childish antics of “how do you know, how do you know, how do you know, on and on ad infinitum). The only reason you dismiss anything contained in the bible as factual is because the bible claims miracles. Since you have already concluded miracles are not possible because of your a priori commitment to the naturalistic worldview, you in fact are the one guilty of circular reasoning.”

        Actually, it’s because there is no positive evidence for miracles external to the Bible. It’s that simple. The further we go what? Actually, I’m not asking how you know anything. I’m telling you that you probably have no positive evidence for miraculous claims external to the Bible and self reference. It’s not a conclusion. It’s just that you can’t.

        “Believer: Doesn’t The New Testament manuscripts record testimony (i.e. “evidence”) of many people that witnessed miracles performed by Jesus?

        Atheist: That doesn’t count as “evidence”.

        Believer: Why not?

        Atheist: Because miracles are not possible”

        This is faulty. The atheist doesn’t repeat that miracles are not possible, any smart person would instead say that there is no positive evidence outside the Bible for any claims of the miraculous, and that for that reason, it can safely be assumed that they are mere myths or legends, without any factual basis in reality.

        “Believer: A miracle is described as an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers. Is it just me or doesn’t that sound like an apt description of the Big Bang?”

        Except, unlike the miraculous claims in the Bible, the “big bang”, the cosmic birth, has direct, observable, recordable evidence backing it up, so it is not miraculous, and just because we cannot explain “why” does not mean we have to resort to the very poor explanation of “God did it”, which explains nothing, and begs the question of God’s existence. Instead, we say, “we don’t know, but we will continue to gather more observable evidence”, something Christians will never be able to do for God or miracles.

        Your idea of how “atheists” (anyone versed in how evidence works) is silly at best, and really, really stupid or intentionally naive at worst.

        I would like evidence for any of the miracles in the Bible, that is not from the Bible itself, and thus merely self-referential textual evidence. I don’t think you have that, but I will wait.

        I would love evidence for anything like a global flood, Jesus’ ascent into the clouds, and anything else you think recorded evidence can verify.

      • I will address “evidence for miracles…like a global flood” later. But before I go down that rabbit trail I would like you to clarify the following:

        1. Who wrote the gospel accounts (i.e. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John)?

        2. Approximately when were they written?

        3. Approximately where were they written?

        4. Who is Paul of Tarsus? When did he write his epistles? Where did he write his epistles?

        Please provide sources for your answers otherwise it’s just “self-referential” correct?

      • Also, in response to the Toledot Jeshu, it was not used as a source to corroborate fundamental tenets of Christianity.

        It seems you have misunderstood the Toledot Jeshu and why it was written. It was written in the fifth-century by Jewish authors. These writers were not writing something complimentary of Jesus Christ to galvanize Christianity; quite the contrary, this was an “anti-gospel” parody of the Christian gospel to ridicule and put doubt in the minds of Christians and anyone that might not have already heard the Christian message.

        The stories claim that Jesus was an illegitimate child, and that he practiced magic and heresy, seduced women, but they also show a paradoxical respect for Jesus. It is clear the purpose of this was to plant a small seed of doubt in the reader (i.e. “Was Jesus really perfect– the unblemished lamb”?) so that the claims below would be more receptive.

        The Toledot Jeshu states that the disciples of Jesus had planned to steal the fallen body of Christ. However, a gardener named Juda discovered their plans and dug a new grave in his garden. Then he removed Jesus’ body from Joseph’s tomb and placed it in his own newly dug grave. The disciples came to the original tomb, found Jesus’ body gone and proclaimed him risen. The Jewish leaders also proceeded to Joseph’s tomb and found it empty. Juda then took them to his grave and dug up the body of Jesus. The Jewish leaders were greatly relieved and wanted to take the body. Juda replied that he would sell them the body of Jesus and did so for thirty pieces of silver. The Jewish priests then dragged Jesus’ body through the streets of Jerusalem. Strangely enough, Juda and Judas are similar, in the Talmud Juda receives thirty pieces of silver and in the New Testament Judas receives thirty pieces of silver. Shortly after this time, the Emperor decreed that grave robbing in Palestine would be a capital offense.

        The importance of this antithetical writing is that it places Jesus in the tomb of Joseph after crucifixion. As a Jewish writer trying to destroy the idea of the “Resurrection” through this anti-gospel parody why not just come out and say, “Jesus was never buried in a tomb!” It seems the most plausible answer why they wouldn’t just come out and say “Jesus was never buried” is that the burial was too strong of a historical FACT to discredit. Therefore, the writers went after the more equivocal and nebulous details (i.e. Jesus’ early life, and HOW his body was removed from the tomb) to “parodize”.

      • “It seems you have misunderstood the Toledot Jeshu and why it was written. It was written in the fifth-century by Jewish authors. These writers were not writing something complimentary of Jesus Christ to galvanize Christianity; quite the contrary, this was an “anti-gospel” parody of the Christian gospel to ridicule and put doubt in the minds of Christians and anyone that might not have already heard the Christian message.

        The stories claim that Jesus was an illegitimate child, and that he practiced magic and heresy, seduced women, but they also show a paradoxical respect for Jesus. It is clear the purpose of this was to plant a small seed of doubt in the reader (i.e. “Was Jesus really perfect– the unblemished lamb”?) so that the claims below would be more receptive.”

        And I will simply never care. I never needed some “antithetical” piece criticizing or rationalizing the myths in the Bible to convince me that they are mythical folklore operating at the cult level. Common sense and observable scientific and recorded historical evidence doesn’t mean I can, or even want to, disprove God or the claims of the miraculous, but it does disprove the idea of a flat earth, of a six-thousand-year-old earth, that the earth was ever flooded, and the idea that walking on water or ascending into clouds has ever happened.

        Global floods, divine judgment, creation myths, and savior figures are all prominent and very similar in manifold religions, and Christ-like figures predating the Christian version of the savior sun-god figure is a reliable way of discerning that Jesus is a pagan knock-off, along with the whole religion of Christianity.

        It suffers from issues of originality.

      • Fourteen years before the Titanic disaster of 1912, a little-remember author named Morgan Robertson’s book, Futility, was published.

        The novel told of a steamship named Titan that was touted as unsinkable, struck an iceberg while making passage across the North Atlantic, and sank with great loss of life.

        Robertson’s Titan was a British steel-hulled passenger ship, 800-feet in length, measuring 70,000 tons, with three propellers, 19 watertight bulkheads and capable of reaching a speed of 24 knots. The Titanic was a British steel-hulled passenger ship, 882-feet long, measuring 60,250 tons, 15 watertight bulkheads, with three propellers and could reach a speed of 24 knots.

        Both the Titan and Titanic had a capacity for carrying 3,000 passengers. There were 2,000 people aboard the fictional ship, and the Titanic was carrying 2,200. Because the vessels were deemed “unsinkable,” they were carrying only the minimum number of lifeboats required by marina law at that time. The Titan had 24 lifeboats and the Titanic had just 20.

        Robertson’s ship struck the iceberg on the starboard side forward. That also is where the Titanic was sliced open when it collided with an iceberg. Both events occurred in April.

        So based on your logic from your last post it would be foolish for anyone to believe the historic nature of the Titanic (if we didn’t have the actual boat to prove it) because “it suffers from issues of originality.”

      • Except that, not only were there sources of direct, observable evidence for the Titanic, but there were multiple, separate, individual textual anecdotal sources of evidence that reinforce each other in supporting the account of the event.

        God, miracles, Jesus’ supposed 500 witnesses and any global floods or young-earth creation accounts have no such reliable sources of evidence backing them up; there is only one book, heavily mistranslated, edited, and rewritten over centuries as it was passed down from different self-serving sources of power and authority, and even its internal inconsistencies keep it from being reliable, if only because of claims of its inerrancy, nothing such from which the individual accounts of the Titanic suffer, because errors of interpretation and perspective are a normal part of real historical accounts.

        Scientific accounts suffer from almost no such discrepancies because they are universally repeatable and therefore verifiable, something else the Bible will never have.

        There are no records of any of the supposed 500 of Jesus’ “eye witnesses”, and there never will be, because it is a myth with no real historical evidence, at least as far as claims of the miraculous or “acts of God” are concerned.

        Historical Jesus is merely questionable in the specifics.

      • Also, please prove to me that Odin, Thor, Zeus, and Mars do not exist as real, living deities. Go ahead. I’ll wait.

      • I’m not letting you off the hook that easy. You claimed Christianity is a LIE and you should be prepared to defend that claim with positive causal evidence. So far your reasoning for coming to that conclusion has been:

        “there is only one book, heavily mistranslated, edited, and rewritten over centuries as it was passed down from different self-serving sources of power and authority” >>>Dead Sea Scrolls prove just the opposite and therefore obliterated this statement.

        “[Christianity] is a mock religion built from the scraps of sun-god worship and paganism.”>>>As Dr. Craig points out, “The claim by scholars who tried to interpret Jesus as just a myth was that in pagan religions you had parallel myths of dying and rising deities and the disciples–somehow aware of these myths–came to apply them to Jesus and believe that Jesus was similarly risen. This movement has UTTERLY COLLAPSED today in scholarship. It only persists in popular sensationalistic literature on THE INTERNET. It is NOT a view held by scholars.” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pI4m4tj_A3E

        “The resurrection and belief in it by twelve disciples is not unique to Christianity”>>>You have made similarity and credibility mutually exclusive. In other words, you have assumed “uniqueness” is a NECESSARY condition for credibility. Uniqueness might be a SUFFICIENT condition for credibility, but it definitely is not a NECESSARY condition, as demonstrated in the Titanic and Titan example.

        You must demonstrate a CAUSAL CONNECTION and you have not done that.

      • I have never denied that Jesus existed. I’ve only claimed that he is not a unique savior figure based on the fact that savior-like figures with 12 disciples and a resurrection predate him, and that he has no real eyewitness evidence for anything that was supposedly miraculous.

        Okay, so, the four things:

        1. Probably guys named Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, but these are not part of the Dead Sea Scroll, so their singular authorship is not something I believe in.

        2. Actually, long after Jesus’ death.

        3. I don’t know the answer to this.

        4. Also don’t know. I think he started his life as Saul, persecuting Christians, and I mean the real kind of persecution, not what today’s American evangelicals cry about.

        Incorrect, it would only be self-referential if I cited a text in providing evidence for itself. What I have is popularly known as an “opinion”.

        This might be worth something:
        http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/gospel-dates.html

        And probably this:
        http://www.pocm.info/getting_started_pocm.html

        I trust their critical scholarship, so that’s about as far as my argument goes. If that’s “copping out” to you, that’s fine, you win.

        I’ll wait to hear from God directly, about his disappointment with my heathen beliefs.

      • I have a very simple proof.

        In my childhood, my pastor told me that God exists, and that I would go to Hell for not believing in him.

        God does not plainly exist (“faith” is required, a strangely convoluted, unreasoned method for belief in anything), so Christianity is just a lie perpetuated for the purpose of social control and manipulation. Somehow, I don’t need to have “faith” in the existence of things like the sun, or gravity, or Earth. God’s existence is not even implied by the existence of other things, such as existence is implied for things like gravity due to its measurable effects on the universe, similar effects such which God does not also produce.

        It is that simple in its factual logic. No need for sophisticated historical or scientific proofs.

      • Still waiting for you to address the following:

        1. Who wrote the gospel accounts (i.e. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John)?

        2. Approximately when were they written?

        3. Approximately where were they written?

        4. Who is Paul of Tarsus? When did he write his epistles? Where did he write his epistles?

        Please provide sources for your answers otherwise it’s just “self-referential”.

        Now that the discussion has been quiet for so long it appears you are attempting to get in the last word and give the illusion that you still have credibility. The further you are dragged kicking and screaming down the corridor of truth the more the shallowness and ridiculousness of your theories come rising to the surface. You can try all the rhetoric and red herrings you like but you have been made sir!!!! 

      • Not really, but feel free to make yourself feel better, so you can sleep better believing in mythical entities that most likely do not exist.

        If you want to verify fine historical details, hire a Biblical scholar, because that I am not, and nor do I claim to be.

        I’m just not stupid enough to believe in fairy-tales.

      • Now that you are offering nothing to the discussion more than childish rhetoric, I think it is fair to say this conversation is over. This will be my last post. It has been fun. I will offer some closing thoughts:

        1. In response to my question about the authors of the New Testament you said, “I honestly don’t know, and, even more honestly, I just don’t care, and I never will.” Hmmm…you “DON’T KNOW and DON’T CARE but you are sure it is an “overblown version of an obscure Jewish cult”. As Spock would say, “FASCINATING!!” Btw, a quick google search will provide the answers to those questions. Even the most liberal historians and bible scholars (ones that do not even believe Jesus is the Son of God) are in agreement who the authors are and when they were written. Something tells me you know this and just refuse to admit it because it is an inconvenient truth that flies in the face of your “Jewish cult” conspiracy theory. The apostle Paul in particular was a Pharisee and a member of the Sanhedrin high court (very orthodox Jews). It seems you are more concerned with clenching on to a worldview that allows you to be your own god than actually arriving at the truth. So this is in fact not about me sleeping better at night; on the contrary, this is about you being able to watch your porn and suppress the emptiness and guilt that follows.

        2. You said, “I’m just not stupid enough to believe in fairy-tales.” >>> The atheist/naturalist worldview: “Once upon no time, there was nothing & nothing happened to nothing & then nothing magically exploded for no reason creating everything & then a bunch of everything magically rearranged itself for no reason which then turned into animals, dinosaurs, and eventually humans. Hmmm, tell me more about how you are “not stupid enough to believe in fairy tales!”

        Sorry but to believe reason came from non-reason, consciousness came from unconsciousness, order came from disorder, intelligence came from randomness, life came from non-life, and everything came from nothing would take more FAITH than I could ever muster.

        The fact is, the reason you have a problem with the bible; more specifically, the super-natural accounts of Jesus is because you have a problem with the existence of God. If God exists, there’s no good reason to be skeptical about miracles. After all, a God who is able to create the entire universe, the odd resurrection would be child’s play!

        “There are not many options – essentially just two. Either human intelligence ultimately owes its origin to mindless matter/[eternal energy] ; or there is a Creator. It is strange that some people claim that it is their intelligence that leads them to prefer the first to the second.”–Dr. John Lennox

        As I bid you farewell, I will leave you with one of my favorite quotes from an agnostic, David Berlinski, from his book, “The Devil’s Delusion”.

        “Has anyone provided a proof of God’s inexistence? Not even close.

        Has quantum cosmology explained the emergence of the universe or why it is here? Not even close.

        Have the sciences explained why our universe seems to be fine-tuned to allow for the existence of life? Not even close.

        Are physicists and biologists willing to believe in anything so long as it is not religious thought? Close enough.

        Has rationalism in moral thought provided us with an understanding of what is good, what is right, and what is moral? Not close enough.

        Has secularism in the terrible twentieth century been a force for good? Not even close to being close.

        Is there a narrow and oppressive orthodoxy of thought and opinion within the sciences? Close enough.

        Does anything in the sciences or in their philosophy justify the claim that religious belief is irrational? Not even ballpark.

        Is scientific atheism a frivolous exercise in intellectual contempt? Dead on.”

      • In other words, the “proof” is the lack of evidence for any of the mythical (“miraculous”) entities or events outlined in the Bible. They never happened, and/or they do not exist. That’s as simple as it gets. They are ancient Jewish myths, and Christianity is an overblown version of an obscure Jewish cult.

      • Still waiting for you to address the following:

        1. Who wrote the gospel accounts (i.e. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John)?

        2. Approximately when were they written?

        3. Approximately where were they written?

        4. Who is Paul of Tarsus? When did he write his epistles? Where did he write his epistles?

        Please provide sources for your answers otherwise it’s just “self-referential”.

        Now that the discussion has been quiet for so long it appears you are attempting to get in the last word and give the illusion that you still have credibility. The further you are dragged kicking and screaming down the corridor of truth the more the shallowness and ridiculousness of your theories come rising to the surface. You can try all the rhetoric and red herrings you like but you have been made sir!!

      • Lack of evidence not proof? Can’t prove a negative?

        That’s fine. God exists, and so do faeries, leprechauns, Thor, ice trolls, Allah, Krishna, talking snakes, giant arks built for global floods, men rising into clouds after having died.

        All kinds of silliness. It all exists, and you can’t disprove it.

      • Still waiting for you to address the following:

        1. Who wrote the gospel accounts (i.e. Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John)?

        2. Approximately when were they written?

        3. Approximately where were they written?

        4. Who is Paul of Tarsus? When did he write his epistles? Where did he write his epistles?

        Please provide sources for your answers otherwise it’s just “self-referential”.

        Now that the discussion has been quiet for so long it appears you are attempting to get in the last word and give the illusion that you still have credibility. Nice try, but your credibility has been completely destroyed.

      • I honestly don’t know, and, even more honestly, I just don’t care, and I never will. The factual incredibility of anything in the Bible has nothing to do with any of those little historical details you’d love to snatch up in order to claim I am ignorant of specialized Biblical knowledge, and it’s just not going to work.

        Simple factual reasoning works, without all the sophisticated historical details that I don’t even need to in order to dismiss the whole of the Bible as religious fiction, a mere myth.

        Thanks.

      • If my credibility is somehow “destroyed”, I fear for God’s credibility, and especially the Bible’s. At least I exist.

      • You can’t win with sophist Christian specialized knowledge. It’s not even necessary. Simple logic dealing with claims of the miraculous and mythical will suffice.

      • You said, “there is only one book, heavily mistranslated, edited, and rewritten over centuries as it was passed down from different self-serving sources of power and authority”>>>
        Do you know what textual criticism is? Do you know the criteria used by scholars to determine the textual purity of any work of antiquity? If so please tell me. Based on this philosophically neutral criteria what documents are the most well attested documents of antiquity?

        What are the Dead Sea Scrolls? Why do you think the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls is considered the most significant archaeological find of the century?

      • The Dead Sea Scrolls are great. Nobody takes them literally except those with a religious belief to uphold, the need to keep their fragile religious fantasies alive by exempting and censoring criticism of their poor factual foundations.

        Look at liberals today. They’re going through the same motions as the most zealous religious fanatics, by upholding anti-scientific claims that will never hold to serious scrutiny, or even simple logic.

        Maybe I didn’t get the memo that the Scrolls are so important. Maybe they are important to Christians and Jews, but to me they’re about as important as Egyptian hieroglyphics, the Rosetta stone, cuneiform tablets, or other relics of early symbolic writing.

        I actually prefer the Iliad, the Odyssey, the Aeneid, and maybe Gilgamesh, precisely because no-one expects me to take them literally, or tells me that not taking them literally will doom an imaginary entity, my soul, to an imaginary place, Heaven/Hell, ruled by an imaginary being, God.

      • http://christiananswers.net/q-abr/abr-a023.html

        “One of the most important contributions of the Dead Sea Scrolls is the numerous Biblical manuscripts which have been discovered. Until those discoveries at Qumran, the oldest manuscripts of the Hebrew Scriptures were copies from the 9th and 10th centuries AD by a group of Jewish scribes called the Massoretes. Now we have manuscripts around a thousand years older than those. The amazing truth is that these manuscripts are almost identical!”
        The only differences between the copies of the bible and the Dead Sea Scrolls from over 1000 years earlier were a few spelling variants. No doctrinal changes whatsoever. Read the last few sentences again real slow to let it really sink in.

        This completely flies in the face of your conspiracy theory: “there is only one book, heavily mistranslated, edited, and rewritten over centuries as it was passed down from different self-serving sources of power and authority.”

      • That’s fine. I was wrong.

        That still doesn’t convince me that the Jewish god exists, that the Earth was ever flooded, that the Earth is only 6000 years old, or that Jesus ever did anything beyond the laws of physical reality, or even that he has real, documented eyewitness testimony recorded anywhere.

        Would love convincing.

      • I’m pretty sure the Jewish scribes, the “Massoretes”, remain devout Jews, and not Christians, probably because they are scholars, and know not to take their own ethnic myths literally.

      • When you can convince me that Abraham Lincoln was not just another knock-off from a pagan myth, I might be able to convince you.

      • Alright. First of all, where are there any pagan myths that both predate and parallel the “story” of Abraham Lincoln, and what textual sources support those particular “myths”, outside of Lincoln’s journal, historical news sources referencing Lincoln, and the writings of his friends and associates?

        None of these, by the way, are used as a dogmatic religious text designed to coerce belief by condemnation to some imaginary, eternal, fiery dungeon with mythical beings such as fallen angels.

        A big one would be the multiple historical sources documenting his assassination. No-one needs to be convinced through “faith”, because all the evidence is there, solidly in place, observable and researchable by anyone.

      • The Civil War is also sort of big, with all kinds of factual and historical records recorded, deep into the culture and social norms of the southern states especially.

      • Show me one Nobel-winning physicist, chemist, or biologist who has scientifically demonstrated the existence of Lincoln. Show me the laboratory where Lincoln’s genome has been mapped out. You can’t. Only historians posit the existence of Lincoln. And no matter how scholarly they may be, they aren’t doing science. They’re compiling hearsay and fairytales and infusing it with a bunch of postmodern jargon so it sounds authoritative.

      • Yes, and all that “compiling hearsay and fairytales” is still more than anything God, the flood, creationism, and miracles have going for them.

        Not only that, I had scientific and historical fact separated neatly. The idea is that they converge upon things such as the origin of the universe. I never said any of the Biblical historical figures required any kind of scientific evidence. The evidence is better for Lincoln’s very factual historical existence than for God’s or any of the other “miraculous” accounts of the Bible.

        Not only that, Lincoln’s account is far more original; flood myths, creation myths, and savior myths from the Mediterranean all mirror and predate those of Christianity.

      • Remember you are supposed to “CONVINCE ME” that Abraham Lincoln was actually the 16th president of the United States and not some mythical hero in a top hat that was recycled from pagan myth stories. Please stay on topic.

        “the stories of the mythical hero in a top hat is still more than…” >>>Is this what passes for good skepticism these days? When providing adequate proof fails, just grade on a curve. In other words, “my fairy tale isn’t as bad as (insert anything that will make my belief not seem so ridiculous).

        You said you had “scientific and historical fact separated neatly”>>>First let’s deal with the “science”. You have not, nor has anyone else been able to provide one single shred of scientific evidence that Lincoln ever existed, published by an unbiased source in a peer reviewed scientific journal. If you could, then you would. But you can’t. And the reason you can’t is because Lincoln never existed.

        Next, “historical fact”>>> Where are all the non bias sources? The only sources we have are from people who knew or knew of Lincoln. Thats circular. Show me one single person, just one, from that era, who claimed to see or know lincoln, who didn’t already fully believe he was the 16th President of the United States. There are none. If there are only biased sources, then that’s the same as there are no sources, which means that the exact opposite situation is what absolutely must have happened. Presidential claims require presidential evidence.

        Lincoln stories are merely Egyptian/Sumerian myths rehashed into a 19th century American context. A radical sect called the “abolitionists” desperately wanted to cast off the rule of slave owners likely deified a semi-mythical character named Lincoln to symbolically rectify their subjugation.

        Abolition > Abe-lition > Abe Lincoln

        The very name ‘Abe Lincoln’ is etymologically derived from 19th century English cognate ‘abolition,’ showing that the words never referred to a PERSON but an IDEA.

        It’s understandable that you still believe in Lincoln because of where you grew up. Consider if you were born in Saudi Arabia, Iran, or as an aborigine. If you were born in any of those places this mythical man in a top hat would have never infected your mind!

        I used to be a believer in Lincoln, but I’m not shackled to the indoctrination of lies anymore. I emancipated my mind!

        Oh and btw, I’m still not convinced. Still waiting on any SHRED of empirical, testable, repeatable UNBIASED PEER REVIEWED SCIENTIFIC FACTS. I’ll continue to wait…

      • I don’t believe I ever asked for “scientific” proof of Jesus’ existence. I am well aware, however, that a historical Jesus existed. I would simply like any of the testimonies of the supposed 500 eyewitnesses to anything miraculous performed by Jesus himself.

        With the way you’re taking things, it would be even MORE difficult to prove that a historical Jesus ever existed, which isn’t my problem, but you’re quickly making it yours with the way you’re attempting to prove that Lincoln hypothetically never existed. Of course I can’t provide some sort of “scientific” proof, and that isn’t even the issue.

        At this rate, Bush and Obama might as well never have existed, either, along with Jesus or Krishna.

        You’re taking this in an absurd direction in order to prove a point that isn’t even some sort of real issue.

      • Remember, the original point of this exercise was that I would be able to “convince you when you could ‘convince me’ about Abraham Lincoln.”

        I hope my absurdity has made the point–no amount of reason can overpower one’s infinite capacity for skepticism. Furthermore, nobody can convince anybody of something they don’t want to be convinced of.

        Nothing is ever certain in history, or certain in science. All we have are degrees of reasonableness, and we can construct models of what happened by selecting the best explanations.

      • Sure, except that Lincoln’s “story” is still far more reasonable. No supposed eyewitness claims to his having been brought back to life, or flying into the clouds, or walking on water, the stuff of mythical fare.

      • You would like factual relativism, because then all the mythical fare of the Bible could be taken as literally true.

      • Yes, if they tried to do that, it would be a fairytale, which is only makes Jesus’ supposedly miraculous life all the more like a fairytale, since not even historians can back it up.

      • “historical sources documenting his assassination”>>>
        Where are all the non bias sources? The only sources we have are from people who knew or knew of Lincoln. Thats circular

      • “A primary source is any original source of information that provides a
        direct or first‐person connection to a historical event. Examples may include:
        documents such as letters, diaries, birth certificates, receipts, and notebooks;
        photographs and drawings; objects, such as clothing or furnishings; oral history
        interviews, and home movies. Primary sources were created by a person who
        witnessed an event first‐hand.”
        http://siarchives.si.edu/sites/default/files/pdfs/Lincoln-Death-MemoriesAndImagesAnalysisActivity.pdf

        Even by non-government accounts of his assassination, enough first hand accounts were gathered, and then reconciled with the country at large, that the factuality of his death is undeniable. Also, Lincoln never got a “resurrection”, so eye-witness accounts are credible.

        Even government sources of things like his birth certificate prove that he was real.

        Where is the certificate for any one of the miracles in the Bible, much less Jesus himself?

      • An account by any one of Jesus’ supposed 500 hundred eye witnesses would be better than nothing. One of them had to be literate.

      • “A primary source is any original source of information that provides a 
        direct or first‐person connection…”>>> Once again this was most definitely written by someone who has already been infected by the mind virus myth that Lincoln was the 16th president. It’s circular–doesn’t count.

        As far as any “writings by Lincoln”>>>

        https://www.facebook.com/alincolnism/photos/a.139108912934560.1073741830.139064409605677/144257655753019/?type=1&stream_ref=10

      • I’m not sure just a signature solves anything. In that case, Jesus could be said to be a fictional second-hand account.

      • You seem to have missed the entire point of the Titan – Titanic post. Based on that story, do you still believe “it suffers from issues of originality” is a valid argument?

        In other words what if the ONLY evidence we have for the Titanic sinking was 5 letters from people who claimed they were one of the survivors, some doctor who claims one of his patients was a survivor, and a copy of a newspaper? Are you saying normally we could reasonably accept the textual evidence from the past as historical and not legendary; HOWEVER, SINCE WE HAVE THIS FICTIONAL BOOK, “FUTILITY” that looks a lot like what these people are claiming, then we must dismiss the evidence no matter how cumulative and compelling it is. WE CANNOT ACCEPT IT BECAUSE “IT SUFFERS FROM ISSUE OF ORIGINALITY!”

      • It would be a little incredible, but it would still be better than claiming 500 eye witnesses with no actual accounts to back up such a claim as having watched a man rise into the clouds.

      • Originality aside, accounts of events regarding the Titanic also do not claim anything outside of what occurs naturally; there is nothing “miraculous” about any of the accounts.

      • “There are no records of any of the supposed 500 of Jesus’ ‘eye witnesses'” >>>There was also no records or archaeological evidence of King David before 1993 and many skeptics called into question his historicity. Bible skeptics have done this numerous times and have been proven wrong through numerous archaeological discoveries that confirmed the bible. These are arguments from silence. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

        http://www.reclaimingthemind.org/blog/2010/09/top-ten-biblical-discoveries-in-archaeology-2-house-of-david/

      • That’s fine, and I could concur that the biblical skeptics were proven wrong, except that my belief or disbelief in King David isn’t based on any supernatural claims of the miraculous, so a refutation of his supposed non-existence is not a cognitive issue for me. My problem is the idea that people walk on water or ascend into clouds, or that there is some grand bearded old man in the sky watching me masturbate, and that I then get told I will burn eternally for not suspending my critical disbelief in these incredulous, mythical notions.

        Those sites also don’t ask me to believe that anyone predating Noah lived for more than 900 years, which also strains my credulity based on biological factual realities and history.

      • And yet, that’s what Christians were busy doing while the constitution didn’t exist. You don’t get to name who is a true christian and who is not, sort of like all these failed attempts at labeling “real” muslims.

    • It would be good for everyone who cares to keep an eye on Dearborn, Michigan. This seems to be the Muslim capital of the US. My question
      is when will they attempt to put in sharia law in that city?

      • I live in Michigan, thankfully 4 hours north of Dearbornistan which looks in areas like a Baghdad ghetto. It is a hotbed of Islamic terrorism and there are neighborhoods where non-Muslims should never enter. You an hear the adhan….that damnable call to prayer….heard 5 times a day, but the ringing of churchbells is discouraged and in some areas, forbidden, because it ”offends” the Muslims.

        I had friends who lived in Dearborn for 40 years who were forced out of their homes by vandalizing, intimidating gangs of Muslim youths. They have NO RESPECT for the elderly…or for women…and certainly not for anything American whatsoever.

        I have a friend from Detroit…a cop…who said that in one month there were nearly 300 warrants for spousal abuse in the Dearborn/Detroit area. It’s become a haven for all that is NOT American.

      • Some people have tried. But here’s the deal about sharia. It does not have to be made the official ”law of the land” to be followed by Muslims. And a de facto observance of sharia law by unsuspecting non-Muslims is celebrated as a victory for Islam any time it happens, and it is great morale booster for them.

        For instance, when a person is forced by pressure from Muslims to stop ”defaming Islam” (which may very well be an expression of the truth about Islam) and he appeases them by no longer exercising his first amendment right to free speech because he is afraid of repercussions, it is interpreted as that person’s conformation to sharia law. Anytime a school forces a student to take off a tee-shirt that has a cross on it or a bible passage so that Muslims won’t be offended, it is considered a conformation to sharia law.

        Here in MIchigan, right now, there is a battle going on in a Dearborn school over an Easter egg hunt. One Muslim father said that it offended his two children and has demanded that the it be cancelled. If the school complies, it will be seen as a victory for Islam and a compliance with sharia law.

        And anytime government officials buy into the victim narrative of Muslims and their claim of having their ”rights” abused, and acquiesce to their demands, it is again considered a victory for the the advancement of Islam.

        So..the smart thing that Americans can do is:

        1. Knowledge is power. First, learn about the enemy, Islam. There are a number of excellent sites and great books…some written by ex-Muslims….. which teach the facts. And what you learn, pass on to others so they too will be well armed for the fight ahead.

        http://www.jihadwatch.org
        http://www.thereligionofpeace.com
        http://www.barenakedislam.com
        http://www.answering-Islam.org
        http://www.prohetofdoom.net
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ib9rofXQl6w Three Things You Need to Know About Islam

        There are many greating youtube videos by ex-Muslims who know share their stories and tell the truth about Islam. Many excellent debates also between Christians and Muslims.

        All of Robert Spencer’s Books are excellent and a great, user friendly book by historian Willam Federer is ”What Every AMerican Needs To Know About the Quran: A history of Islam and the United States”…….full of information and tidbits about Americans and Islam.

        2. Do NOT surrender to the bully mentality that characterizes many Muslims, but stand up for your rights of free speech. Be prepared for threats, though. Be civil. Be strong. Be honest.

        3. Get politically active. Be a a pain in the butt of your congressmen and monitor their actions and when they are working to comply with Islamic law, tell them to stop. Join the Tea Party and make your voice heard. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.

        4. And lastly, but most importantly….Pray for America.

        Never let down your guard. Do NOT fall for the propaganda and the cry of persecution coming from the Muslim community. Remember, Islam is here to defeat us.

    • Where, into the swamp? The Colonel is misleading us all, when he fails to include facts regarding Wahabi Islamists from Saudi Arabia, and Saudi investments in America, and the close ties to the Bush family, BCCI, CIA funding of Al Qaeda and Bin Laden, etc.

  6. It’s clear why this is happening in America, we’re afraid of Islamists. Period. Christians aren’t waging crusades anymore so nobody’s scared of them, but Islamists call for a jihad against us when we just blink the wrong way at them. Some Americans, too many perhaps, feel that 9/11 and other terrorist attacks committed against us here and abroad are only our fault and that we have to atone for our sins against the rest of the world. If we’d just allow them to do whatever the hell they want here they’ll stop hating us and call off the jihad. If we bend over backwards to accommodate them they’ll stop hating us and let us be. Please, they hate everything we stand for and have no intention of “coexisting” with us. They want to erase our culture and traditions in order to make room for theirs while they take advantage of our system and our freedoms. It makes me sick and I’m on to them.

    • They view that as more weakness and despise us more. Christians need to understand that we have to fight for what we believe in or die.

    • The Islamic agenda: Immigrate, populate, infiltrate, legislate, intimidate, subjugate, dominate. Islam is a scourge on mankind and out to be eradicated from the earth.

      Islam is a barbaric, misogynistic, hegemonic totalitarian system
      seeking world domination, that camouflages itself in the garb and
      rhetoric of religion…..and as such, it has no claim on the First
      Amendment. I don’t think that any of our Founding Fathers could have
      imagined that Muslims would have gained such a foothold in America, with the objective of supplanting our culture with an Islamic one.

      The very notion of a ”moderate” Muslim (who doesn’t wage jihad against
      non-Muslims) is alien to Islamic thought, and such a person is called
      a hypocrite by allah in the Quran, worthy of a savage death and
      destined for Hell.

      Jihad against the infidel is OBLIGATORY for every professing Muslim, though, thankfully, there are millions who are ”lousy” Muslims, who don’t obey the Quran.

      Using a victim narrative to elicit sympathy and acquiescence to their demands is an oft used tactic. You can always depend on CAIR or other Islamic groups (also under the umbrella of the Muslim Brotherhood) to appear on TV to defend Islam any time there is someone who dares to report on the despicable treatment of Muslim women and children, and non-Muslims throughout the world. The apologists always cry foul, ”Islamophobe” and play the victim, and then count on political-correctness-advocates to keep the truth suppressed.

      Appeasement never works for bullies…whether in the school yard or when dealing with Islamists bent on killing us all. But with a Muslim in the White House, and Muslims in administering positions in the CIA, the DHS, and in other official positions with access to classified information, appeasement has been the government’s go-to, knee-jerk response.

      The Muslim Brotherhood’s goal is to destroy America from within, by using our own Constitution and laws against us,and if there is anyone who thinks that they are not making huge leaps in achieving that goal is a fool. You cannot conquer an enemy who you refuse to recognize. Only when we admit that ISLAM is our enemy will we ever be able to rid our country of its evil.

      Americans had better wake up and smell the sharia before its too late.

      • Amen
        and I would willingly rack another round in the chamber and exhale slowly for another one for one any day in a fox hole with the Honorable Allen West.

      • You seem to be well informed about Islam. You described the “Islamic agenda: Immigrate, populate, infiltrate…” There is an Islamic/Arabic word that describes this agenda (I believe it’s in the Koran) but I cannot think of it. Do you know the word for this by any chance? Also, they have a word for allowing deception or lying for the purpose of infiltration. Do you know that word? I have tried finding it through Google, but to no avail. Thanks for any help brother.

      • 1.Quran 8:39. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allah) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allah Alone [in the whole of the world]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allah), then certainly, Allah is All-Seer of what they do.
        Quran 8:67. It is not for a Prophet that he should have prisoners of war (and free them with ransom) until he had made a great slaughter (among his enemies) in the land. You desire the good of this world (i.e. the money of ransom for freeing the captives), but Allah desires (for you) the Hereafter. And Allah is All-Mighty, All-Wise.

        ”The world is divided into the House of Islam and the House of War, the DAR al-ISLAM and the DAR al-HARB. The Dar al-Islam is all those lands in which a Muslim government rules and the law of Islam prevails. Non-Muslims may live there under dhimmitude. The outside world, which has not yet been subjugated, is called the “House of War,” and strictly speaking a perpetual state of jihad, of holy war, is imposed by the law.

        The law thus divides unbelievers theologically into those who have a book and profess what Islam recognizes as a divine religion and those who do not; politically into dhimmis….those who have accepted the supremacy of the Muslim state and the primacy of the Muslims, and harbis, the denizens of the Dar al-harb, the House of War, who remain outside the Islamic frontier, and with whom therefore there is in principle, a CANONICALLY OBLIGATORY PERPETUAL STATE OF WAR until the WHOLE WORLD is either converted or subjugated.”

        Source: Bernard Lewis, The Multiple Identities of the Middle East, Schocken Books, New York, 1998, pp.121-122.

        2. Al-Taquiyaa is the lpractice of ying sanctioned and rewarded by allah when Muslims gain the trust of the infidel by misrepresenting themselves as peaceful, in order to use that trust against them at a more advantageous time.

        3. Last time I looked, I was a female. 🙂

      • If you want to learn about Islam, I highly recommend the books by Robert Spencer, who also runs the JihadWatch.org website which if chuck full of valuable, reliable information.

        And for a concise, user friendly book about Islam and it’s connection to America, I encourage you to buy the book by Christian historian, William J. Federer, called ‘What Every American Needs To Know About The Quran : A History of Islam and the United States”. It’s terrific and you’ll have a lot of info right at your fingertips.

      • Great. Thanks for the help! You seem like a well informed brother in Christ. I’d like to stay in contact. Do you have a Facebook page?

      • YW. No. But I’m usually on GodfatherPolitics, PatriotUpdate or other conservative sites just about every day.

      • I’ll keep my eye out. I don’t know if you follow Charisma News articles at all, but they have some very intelligent and relevant articles from contributors with a Christian worldview. We could use some more informed people as yourself contributing in the comments.

        Best Regards,

        James

  7. Indeed the US has lost its way…as Col. Allen cites above
    …and it is relatively bipartisan…except for a President who sometimes treats republicans, christians and jews (jews of Israel) –as more of a threat than radical islamists.

  8. Mod…Please note that your formatting on your pages is cutting off the last 5-6 characters in each line. Makes it difficult to read when we have to guess at the end of each line.

  9. Have you noticed what is happening on some of our college campuses? In Chicago, at Loyola and DePaul, two Catholic Universities there are anti-Israel movements taking place supported by Muslim and anti Israel students – http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/loyoladivest-passes-again/
    What I find disappointing is that the Christian students do not grasp the persecution of Christians and other religions around the world by Muslims.
    Please check out the DIVEST Israel movements taking place on many college campuses. We only have our selves to blame for this.
    Please check out: https://www.facebook.com/SJPLUC
    If you go to the SJPLUC facebook page you will find out that this is Palestine awareness week at Loyola University.
    God help us.

    • The kids will wake up; but we do have to pray for them. And, when we get a chance, we have to help them understand. And the corrupt college administrators and professors will also be gone, in God’s Time.

      • God’s time is no time. I will corrupt children’s souls, and lead them down the path to flames. Jesus cannot help you now. He is dead. I will corrupt your soul, and rape your virtues.

      • Tell me about it. Maybe you can convert me. Really! Whatever religion you practice –I can’t tell by your post– tell me what’s good about it. Is there something about your particular religion that makes you want to practice it? What is it?

      • I’m not out to convert anyone. That’s not my job. I’m out to criticize the idea of America somehow being a “Christian” nation. I simply let the Christian majority that they can’t have everything their way. If people automatically assume I’m muslim simply because I’m critical of Christianity, that’s their personal problem.

    • What modern Christians seem to have forgotten, you have to fight for what you believe in. They need to read the old Testament. Jesus stated that he did not come to do away with the Law or common sense. Most people view Jesus as a peaceful lamb to be sacrificed. That is what he chose because that is what Gods price was for the Law to be fulfilled. It was not an example for all Christians to be slaughtered. God helps those that help themselves and led Israel in many battles. Christians will take up arms and defend to the death what we believe if it comes to that. I had much rather die fighting for freedom and my beliefs than surrender to Lucifiers minions.

    • Go to Israel to see how christians are treated. 2nd class, all the way. Forced from their homes to make room for “more pure” people. Read the Tora Ha’Melech.

    • Not necessarily. If it has to be done here…it will be. That’s what they plan to do to you; and a whole lot of people are gonna wake up to the fact. People who love this country are getting smart.

      • I hope so.. they are infiltrators and are at the highest level of government they are building training camps were they are learning about armed assault all closed off to the public unhindered by government…and in plain sight.. so ask yourself this who is protecting them??

  10. America has not lost its way….the people who scream “the first amendment for free speech and religion are now trying to prevent freedom of religion for muslims as well as Christians. While the basis for he Muslim religion is peace through conquering and subduing all other religions, the Jewish religion did the same thing to the first Christians. The difference is, The Jews had leaders and citizens that were open to the truth and change. So lets put the complete truth out there Allen. Extremism can be found in all religions, and basically any idea.(The NRA…ring a bell) Right now, you are pushing the salem witch hunts all over again. Whoever wants to get back at someone, just say they are a witch, or a “commi”…..now, just say they are a islamist. Fear blinds understanding of the truth and opens the mind to ignorance and acceptance of embellished lies. Even during the christian crusades against the muslim take over, the truth was pushed aside and false christian ideology took its place. Just tell the truth of the Christianity faith and relationship with God. You need to show that Christianity is different from the enemy, not just like them.

    • Islam unlike any other religion actually has passages in their Quran that instructs them to torture and murder anyone who doesn’t believe in their god. No doubt mankind has imposed their hate into religion in history but hate is not a written command in the Jewish scrolls or Christian bible. Evil Jewish leaders killed those who professed Jesus Christ on their own volition as well as Christians who did the same. Although the Jews and Christians haven’t murdered anyone in my lifetime or that of my parents, grandparents, or great grandparents, the slaughtering of humans by the Muslims is a current and ongoing action throughout the world. Col. West is wise to rise the warning flag for every American that doesn’t intend to convert to Islam. When you are personally at the losing end of their violence I doubt what other religions have done 100s of years ago will matter. Look up Quran 4:56 for further proof of the Muslim’s “peacefulness”.

      • God commanded Israelites to kill the inhabitants of Canaan. What’s the difference? In 2012, prominent Israeli rabbis published a book, Tora Ha’Meleck
        that advocates killing non-jews, even if they are innocent. Specifically women and children. They explain that children may one day turn against Israel, so better to kill them first. Look it up, this has been suppressed here, but that’s the current state of affairs there. Not much difference with Islam, really.

      • So you know just enough of the Bible to be dangerous. First of all God, as recorded in the Bible, DID INDEED order complete annihilation of the people’s who were wicked, as survivors would continue to practice their evil. The rabii’s writings were not inspired by God. I do understand that you, I’m sure believe in nothing but yourself. Good luck with that.

      • But the killing of the inhabitants of Canaan continue, an evil practice to say the least, to this day (operation Cast Lead 2009). The Bible teaches us that the Israelites were complicit in wicked behavior: offering their children as a sacrifice to the false god Molech, among the many false gods they protected and raised “in the high places”. In modern day Israel, Rabbis (reflecting the will of the Knesset) continue the evil practice of teaching that killing survivors who potentially might turn against the inhumanity of State policy is legitimate in the eyes of God. This can only be described as blasphemy. One can imagine Jesus returning to Israel (and the Church at the Vatican) and throwing out the moneychangers once again.

      • You have Old testament rationale in a New Testament age. The age of God’s wrath is yet to come when the Anti-Christ performs the ultimate blasphemy. All men are in the age of grace at this time. Jew or gentile, all have been given opportunity to be forgiven by calling upon Jesus. As for Israel their sins are no worse than any other peoples’ and God’s immense grace is protecting them as He has held off all the world’s deserved destruction. The Bible says that Israel will turn back to the living God by recognizing and accepting the Lord Jesus as Messiah.

      • How about entering the second decade of the 21st century? Now which religion is at war around the world with Christians, Hindus, Buddists, Jews, animists and everywhere they intersect with the rest of the world?

      • One look at the Tora Ha’Melech will tell you which religion has joined the extremist muslims. Col.West only presents one side of the issue, a half-truth. He conflates Islamic “control” of oil resources with the real culprits: Oil corporations. The oil corporations have global investments and profit producing fields worldwide. They have no allegiance to the U.S., including Col West, you or I. They “are the Arabs” to quote from the movie The Formula. This is the state of affairs in the 21st Century. Religion takes a back seat to Corporate power, the real player in global politics and wars worldwide.

      • You’ve still not entered the, second decade of the 21st century, why not?

        Control of oil? Surely you jest, if the US wanted control, why’d they bug out of Iraq and not stay and pump as much as possible out? Why are we in Afghanistan? There’s no oil? Why not ignore Iraq and simply take over Saudi fields? That’s where the build up started.

        Yeah, corporations are “bad”, do you have a job?

      • “The People”, need to get together and start at their State Capital. They need to remind their Elected Officials; they took an Oath and either “Honor” the “Oath” they took or get out. Put the “Fear of God” in the Elected Officials and they will either switch gears or not, but at least we will know where they stand. Obama has infiltrated “Our Government” and “Our Country” with Muslims and if we don’t take a stand, we will pay the price. Don’t stop calling, writing or faxing, but numbers standing in front of your State Capital speaks volumes.

    • Vincent, it is people like you who are the problem in our country. Allen West is not about to go on a witch hunt like you say. He is seeing things just like they are. Islamists are taking over this country. Sharia law will eventually be our judicial system if we don’t stand up for what we believe in. I don’t think that you will be so understanding and tolerant of the Islamists/Muslims when they stone your daughter (I don’t know if you have one or not, but you get the idea) for not wearing the correct clothes or being seen with the wrong guy. You can’t be serious when you compare Islam to Judaism or Christianity. Islam is not a religion of peace. The Quran demands the killing of non-Muslims. This is not a witch hunt. This is protecting our country. We are way past being politically correct. It’s time to stand up for our country and our faith. You and the other sheep without a backbone can go and live somewhere else, if you don’t like it.

    • Relativism is for cowards. The Christian religion is not just like Islam .Neither are the Jews. You’d love Free Speech to die. And, all religions but Islam, too. West is correct in what he says; and you just made his point…in the first sentence you posted, no less. Although, it is a little tricky, trying to figure out what you want to say, when you don’t indicate where your quote ends. Yeah, Islam is very peaceful. Apparently, Muslims are even at peace while people of other religions are being murdered in the name of the so-called. But, you probably think that’s freedom of religious expression. Good luck with that, pal.

      • And because it was so horrible, we must NEVER stop speaking about the horror and terror that Islam reigns on innocent people. We must NEVER forget 9-11 !

      • Also. Dont forget who funded Al Qaeda and Bin Laden when they were freedom fighters. We usually keep close surveillance on dangerous groups like these. Our intel agencies are not complete bumblers.

      • “Our intel agencies are not complete bumblers.”
        Wanna bet? If they’re not, perhaps they turn their heads under orders?

      • How did they get their hands on anthrax, weapons grade dry stuff, only available at bases in the US, like Dugway proving grounds. And then send it only to Democrats. Al Qaeda must really hate Democrats.

    • Vincent your an enabler and part of the problem how is it working out in the middle east for secular muslims and minorities for gays for little girls in Iran and Yemen forced in to marriage at 8 ?? all one big happy family are they?? your a jackass to think that when they have enough influence and numbers it wont be your head on a pole.. I am afraid that the facts just don’t fit the theory that muslims are on the whole tolerant and islam is a religion of peace… and as for the crusades is that the best you’ve got??? have you ever heard of the gates of Vienna.. do some bloody research you idiot muslims have been at war with every country that gave it credence from its very conception… which were by the way the ramblings of a mad man who by his own account was a war lord and kiddy fiddler..

    • LTC West HAS shown that Christianity is different from the enemy; he didn’t just talk the talk, he joined the military, put his life on the line for Americans (including your butt), innocent Afghanistans and Iraqi’s AND…came home to continue serving our Country and to this very day, is still serving God and America.
      LTC West is a man of character. U-B-A-Coward.

    • You want to know the truth? You can’t handle the truth. Truth is when they do take over the government and this country and I pray they don’t, they will appear at your door way and you have a choice, Convert or die. Do not take more than a second to think about it, because the truth is they will behead you.
      Consider yourself warned.

  11. Political correctness has worked for the progressives for several decades and the Islamists are simply following suit. Of course it helps when both the president and the attorney general hate this country and are trying to “fundamentally change it”.

  12. No article yet on Nevada:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfOVg5R4ngA&feature=youtu.be
    Need more Militia to equal the numbers of BLM. Need more Militia and people to show force peacefully. BLM had books rooms for two weeks before starting this. BLM has brought in Special Force guys from Black Water, etc., and other forces. BLM has Helicopters, AR-15’s, Tasers and other stuff. BLM said they will start arresting people if the same thing happens again. They are saying this has to do with a Corporate Interest with connections to the Military, because they want the water and water for mining weapon grade minerals. Hope I did not miss quote anything wrong.

    • It also mentions that the area is considered prime real estate for developers and that rancher Clive Bundy refuses to sell. And yup, just might be the Big Coward Reid we are getting a whiff of, which wouldn’t be the first time he’s been involved in a real estate scandal.

      • Thanks for sharing the Canada Free Press article. Hope others read it. I agree. Gov Sandoval should call in the Nat’l Guard to protect citizens and call off the BLM army. What a bunch of crap. obama and hillary claim to not know anything about the Benghazi murders or the IRS and letting in millions of illegals but an old rancher, well gosh-darn! Send in the troops!! What A-holes!! People who voted for obama shouldn’t want to show their faces in public anymore.

      • Interesting how all the departments have armies. This is reprehensible, rounding up the cattle and in the process killed some. they brought in backhoes to bury the cattle. according to Police State dot com. There is and was no reason for this action, they could have taken him to court. They tasered Bundy Son several times. Clearly just intimidation tactics when none of this had to happen.

      • Yes, where are their Governor and Sheriff? OOPS! The Sheriff will be showing up this morning at the Ranch and the governor should be thrown out!

  13. Don’t pusyfoot around Mr West you know as well as everybody else that they are mostly imported immigrants by non other then their and our master or rather our king wannabee and their brother in the mushlim brotherhood.barry whatshisname

  14. This is a buffoonish article from one of our great buffoons. Congrats Mr. West. No one should ever call you colonel again.

    • Speak for yourself, you blind fool. The facts are all around us and you continue to walk along blindly believing in those that will persecute you and the women in your life. They don’t come in peace nor willing to blend in like the rest of us. They will take your voice and rights away, just as they are doing in other countries. Take your head out of the sand. We need more patriotic Americans willing to stand up for and with us, like Mr. Allen West.

      • This Sergeant wants to know if the Colonel is willing to mention Saudi Arabian wahabism, madrassas in the US, Saudi ties to the Bush family, Saudi Bin Laden funded by CIA, Bush Sr. ties to CIA, BCCI and the Carlyle Group, and CIA funding of Al Qaeda with subsequent non-surveillance of this dangerous group. I’ll pass his answers down to the non coms, who will be, as always, in the trenches, in the line of fire.

      • SGtMD, with all due respect to you for serving our country, You are mixing up issues.
        I’m not saying what you are talking about isn’t valid. It just isn’t valid in this thread.
        Nothing you just posted has anything to do with The BLM army and the “Police Action” against an ordinary citizen.
        If your issues bother you that much then you have the right to email him about it. The link is at the bottom of the page.
        Again thank you for your service

      • How is the Bush family responsible for the potential Islamification of America going forward? Please tell us if you think the current admin is aiding and abetting.

      • Interesting, isn’t it? Obama continuing the same policies, in the Middle East, and along Russia’s borders, progressing from South Ossetia to Ukraine. My troops will remain in place, as the fighters being sent are proxies from places like Libya and Guantanamo.

      • Allen west is right, where i live they are taking over motels,convenience storesand I could not get gas without Muslims owning or leasing gas stations, they are already getting a foothold in this countrythey are even buying dry cleaners laundromats,we better wake up or going to find ourselves working for them and living by their rule, not me I will fight to the death for this country and how our president has open the gate to let everyone in who wants to live hereRepublicans will rule again and I can’t wait for the day that Obama is out of office and this administration get kicked to the curb also

    • Why would you call him a buffoon for pointing out how serious this Islamist threat is? The article is not meant to be all inclusive of every nuance of the battle.

    • And no one should ever call you an American. Now get out of my country you piece of raghead excrement.

    • no way out

      Well, I see CAIR is represented here today.

      I think everyone here but you is grateful to call Allen West Colonel.
      I think everyone here but you is grateful to have people like Colonel West writing and commenting about the realities that the US is facing.

      There is a way out for you-don’t let the door hit you in the as$.

  15. They don’t believe in abortion so its not going to take them long to out number us. Then what do you thinks going to happen ? If you don’t become a muslim then it will be off with your head. Good that some are finally waking up but am afraid its to late.

  16. Mr West ignores the fact that the most virulent Islam, Wahabi, emanates from Saudi Arabia. The Saudis have so much cash invested here, that no politico can touch them, or else face the disaster of massive cash pull out. Not one word about Saudi influence. He would be forced to think (a healthy exercise) about and declare the close ties the Bush family has with his arch Islamic enemy. And the BCCI scandal, CIA funding of Al Qaeda, cooperation with Bin Laden, etc. It gets tricky when you have to consider the whole picture. Yet the Colonel harps on half, studiously ignoring the whole picture. What is his position on Saudi investment in madrassas around the world, especially here at home. Any word on Saudi backed hate factories in the US would be helpful to his audience.

    • You sound like someone who could confirm for me something I read which I find disturbing. is it true that Saudis do not have the same visas requirements of other nationalities? also freedom of movement without any notification requirement? Also I seem to remember on Saudi student implicated in a terrorist plot. He was not charged, but Kerry had to made a special trip to the UAE to speak with a Saudi prince about this student. seemed like Kerry was taken to the woodshed.

      • regarding the freedom of movement and visas those are relatively true from what i can see friend. =/

      • Money sure does talk. I read where Saudi visa applicants were not properly vetted at our embassy there. Also, a potential 9/11 participant Saudi soldier was detained at Miami airport. He was belligerent and stated “I’ll have you fired” among other epithets. We could have learned more about 9/11 if we had not sent him back to Saudi Arabia.

      • Exactly, Saudi Arabia. Where Aramco and major oil Corporations have a vested interest. Col West points out the pawns in the game while ignoring the paymasters.

  17. Allan West: “We are indeed witnessing the rise of Islamists in America. How has it come to this, that such a small minority has gained such a powerful political voice and influence? How is it that an organization like the Council for American Islamic Relations (CAIR) is even allowed to exist in our Republic?”

    Those are indeed the questions we should all be asking ourselves. However, the answers provided are only part of the reason? Trace this back to its genesis and there is no question that the Muslims are here proliferating their religion and evangelizing our posterity because of the First-Commandment-violating, polytheistic-enabling First Amendment’s Free Exercise Clause:

    “…Although the First Amendment does not allow for establishing one religion over another, by eliminating Christianity as the federal government’s religion of choice (achieved by Article 6’s interdiction against Christian test oaths), Amendment 1 authorized equality for all non-Christian and even antichristian religions. When
    the Constitution failed to recognize Christian monotheism, it allowed Amendment 1 to fill the void by authorizing pagan polytheism.

    “Amendment 1 did exactly what the framers proclaimed it could not do: it prohibited the exercise of monotheistic Christianity (except within the confines of its church
    buildings) and established polytheism in its place. This explains the government’s double standard regarding Christian and non-Christian religions. For example, court participants entering the United States District Court of Appeals for the Middle District of Alabama must walk by a statue of Themis, the Greek goddess of justice. And yet, on November 18, 2002, this very court ruled that Judge Roy Moore’s Ten
    Commandments Monument violated the First Amendment’s Establishment Clause. Despite many Christians’ protests against this hypocrisy, it was in keeping with the inevitable repercussions of the First Amendment.

    “…Christians hang their religious hat on Amendment 1, as if some great moral
    principle is carved therein. They have gotten so caught up in the battle over the misuse of the Establishment Clause – the freedom from religion – that they have overlooked the ungodliness intrinsic in the Free Exercise Clause – the freedom of religion….”

    For more, see online Chapter 11 “Amendment 1: Government-Sanctioned Polytheism” of “Bible Law vs. the United States Constitution: The Christian Perspective” at http://www.bibleversusconstitution.org/BlvcOnline/biblelaw-constitutionalism-pt11.html. Be sure to also check out our Constitution Survey in the right-hand sidebar.

  18. You doubters will not wake up until the muslims are at your door.
    Read some history concerning the muslims. Why is it ok for them to build their places of prayer in America but America can’t build one christian church in their country.

    Does any one think it is because the whitehouse is occupied by a muslim ???
    If you don’t believe that just check out his actions concerning all muslim people and nations. One of his major oops was the 57 state statement. I think that is the number of muslim nations.

    • They are already at our doors and here we sit. No one can answer the question, why can’t someone do something. Why can’t we arrest the President and Holder for Treason? Why can’t we arrest them for breaking our Laws? Why can’t we arrest all those that are in “Our Government” who are breaking our Laws and putting “Our Country” in danger? Who in “Our Country” can do this?

      • If Obama was not the first Black president he would have been impeached by now. If you say anything about him you are a racist.
        They wanted to impeach Nixon-what he did was child’s play compared to this President- Nixon tried to bug a hotel. They tried to impeach Clinton -for what lying to Congress -this happens every day with this President.
        OK, so I’m a racist.

      • Obama is not Black and if people would quit calling him the “Black President” then maybe their thinking would change.

      • He’s black in the eyes of the majority of blacks, and apparently has not had dealings with the white side for quite a while. He seems to be denouncing that.

      • Who cares that he is denouncing that he is part white. The fact is, he is not Black and when individuals keep referring to him as Black, and it allows him to keep using it.

      • But he knows nothing about growing up Black in America. He went to private schools except for the time he spent being educated as a Muslim.

      • Reba

        I think he should be called the first Muslim President.
        Oh, there I go again, I must be a racist.

      • he is a mulatto have black half white, He ran as a Black man because he knew that playing the Race card would work. H made glorious speeches how he was going to help the blacks and yet he has done nothing for them but dumb them down with Common Core and inciting violence. He also propagated voter fraud which is how he got elected

      • I am on my way out to be honest but it is great to see you, Moron brendan is telling me I am not a Patriot. Yawn! see you later

      • It was somewhat of a rhetorical question. 90% of the black vote will go democrat.

        As for Obama’s DNA, I care not. There is one race, the human race. Obama’s the liberal fascist strain of that race.

      • “Why can’t we arrest the President and Holder for Treason? ”

        How about following the Rule of Law and start impeachment proceedings? Do that and see where it leads. At this point, do you really believe the majority of the American people believe Obama should be impeached? The 47% enjoy being lied to, so long as their gravy train continues to give them free food, shelter, cable TV and iPhones.

      • Okay, start Impeachment proceedings, and watch it sit on Harry Reid desk. Obama and Holder are guilty of Treason as well as others. As for the 47%, not all are on the “Gravy Train”.

      • Impeachment without a conviction will do nothing. Should it be done on principle, sure, but the politics would yield too many sympathizing with Obama.

        What would your articles of impeachment contain? Can you list precisely how you’d charge Obama?

      • My point exactly! Saying that let them process it and see where it goes and then they can take the next step. As long as Boehner is in, nothing will be done. Let’s start with Benghazi, allowing Radicals Muslims in our Government and letting Radical Muslims into “Our Country” that have ties to terrorism. Not following our Laws!

      • Boehner isn’t stopping any Congressman from initiating impeachment proceedings.

        Next, please make a list of treasonous offenses.

      • Let’s start with Benghazi, allowing Radicals Muslims in our Government and letting Radical Muslims into “Our Country” that have ties to terrorism. Not following our Laws!

      • Those are not charges. Just an FYI, take a look at the charges on Nixon, they’re applicable to Obama.

        What you’ve written aren’t.

      • gjsmith

        Nixon was a school boy compared to Obama. Nixon tried to bug the Watergate Hotel -Obama has bugged the US plus so much more. Nixon did not try to minimize America -that is Obama’s secret agenda.
        They tried to impeach Clinton-all he did was lie to Congress about his personal affairs. Obama has lied to Congress and the American public countless times –
        If Obama was not the first Black President, he would have already been impeached.

      • You’re reading my reply wrong,

        1) Obama should be impeached, but the charges must be valid.
        2) The IRS scandal alone should be the means to impeach, but the Senate will never convict.
        3) So, why not win the Senate and make impeachment stick, by a conviction and ejection of Obama from the WH?

      • “How about following the Rule of Law and start impeachment proceedings?”
        Pray tell how you can impeach an illegal President let alone start proceedings?

      • Did I mention anything about Kenya? Don’t know about his mom but his dad was a British subject at the time of his birth.

      • More than one reason actually. First and foremost, neither his long or short form BCs pass the smell test so, there is no need to go into the other reasons.

    • You are concerned that we do not share the same standards as other countries?
      You ask why Muslim Americans are allowed to build houses of worship in this country.
      The answer is because this is their country too.

      • He made a valid statement. Why is it okay for them to build their Mosque here in the United States, but we can’t build Christian Churches in their Country? Why is the United States at war with them, but yet Obama is letting them in by the millions into “Our Country”? If they are legal and want to live by “Our Country” Laws, fine, but the Mosque are being used for training.

      • Muslim Americans are not Saudis or Iranians… they are Americans.
        Many Muslim Americans were born here.
        And not all those that immigrated even came from the Middle East.
        The nation with the largest Muslim population is Indonesia, where there are plenty of churches.

        Why should some American citizen be denied the right to have a house of worship because of what some other country does?

        We are Americans and we do not repress our minorities simply because some other countries do.

        As to being “at war with them”…

        We are at war with radical Islam, not all muslims.
        Do you want to know who is fighting the hardest against radical Islam and who radical Muslims are killing the most?
        …Other muslims.
        Talk to the Egyptians, for example, who are practically fighting a civil war in the streets after overthrowing Morsi and the radical muslim brotherhood government.
        Particularly in the Middle East, there is a fight for the future of Islam between the radicals and the rest of the muslim world.
        Who do you think Al Qaeda in Iraq is fighting now and who they are killing when they set off bombs?

        Back to Muslim Americans…
        Give me a reason why my Muslim neighbor, born in America, whose parents came from Albania years ago, should not be able to go to a mosque.

      • I don’t have a problem with American Muslims, providing they are true Americans. I have a problem with the ones that are radicals and are here under false pretense. I have a problem with them using their Mosque to fund terrorist and training individuals to become terrorist in “Our Country”. I have problems with them building camps all over the United States. My biggest problem is Obama letting millions in that have ties to terrorist.

      • No they’re not, that’s a bold face Lie!!! They are persecuting, Murdering & beheading Christians ALL over the World.. islam is not a Religion it’s a Sadistic Murderous Cult! muslims don’t allow Christians to practice there Faith & Religion, or Build Christian Churches in there Muslim countries but you want to whine & cry like everyone is persecuting you & your faith??? Ahahahahah! That’s the sadistic pot calling the, Christian kettle black isn’t it? You LOVE islam so much? GO TO A MUSLIM COUNTRY that doesn’t allow Christians you Pig.

      • Irish_Sunset
        I posted this earlier I think it fits with your comment:

        When Christian extremists were killing abortion doctors, Christians where outraged even if they were anti abortion. SO …
        Why aren’t Muslims outraged with the killings of innocent people in the name of Allah.
        At 911, I did not read of any Muslim outraged nor at any other time.

        Why are they as a group different than Christians?

      • They aren’t… but part of the teachings in there sadistic cult book, tells them specifically to LIE to anyone that is not muslim. Make sense now? They will tell you Anything, to get what they want. Obama is proof of that… I have yet to see a world leader Lie as much as he does, Mohammad is “NOT” a Prophet! He was A murderous pedophile, that created a cult to promote rape, incest, pedophilia & murder!

      • Brendan

        Tell me, as the resident Muslim here could I just walk into your Mosque as you could my Church?

      • There are hundreds of millions of moderate muslims.

        I am not a muslim, but I have no right to tell a moderate muslim that he is not a muslim just because he does not fit someone else’s interpretation

        Just as I have no right to see you are not a real Christian because your version of Christianity does not fir what I think a Christian is supposed to be.

      • I am concerned is why muslims build places of worship in this country and not allow other religions to build the same in their country. I did not mention anything about muslim Americans..
        An American is an American. Those that choose to hyphen their former country with America are NOT Americans.
        Yes immigration made this country what it is but the people; who come here became to become Americans., I encourage that. If you want to come here for the handouts and not learn the language and customs. STAY WHERE YOU ARE.
        The “We Don’t Want to Offend Anyone Crowd” who started the multicultural bull are a big problem for America.
        Life is offending to many. In their desire not to offend anyone they seem to have forgotten about the Americans who were born here. We get offended gite often but it is ignored because of political correctness.Which is a crock of dung.

      • Most muslim Americans I met speak English fine.
        Many were born here.
        Many also immigrated but speak English (some better than others)… with the exception of some much older family members who have a hard time learning english… but that’s pretty normal for most immigrant families… the elderly members have a hard time learning english.

        As to building mosques… please give one good reason why a bunch of Americans who happen to be muslim can’t have a house of worship.

        this is the United States of America… we don’t measure what freedoms we permit based on what Iran or Saudi Arabia permit.

      • I did not say they shouldn’t or cant build here. My question is why muslim nations will not allow christian houses of worship built in their country but it is ok to build here. It is a two way street do not expect to do what you forbid to be done in your country.

      • As for one good reason why we shouldn’t have mosques here:
        A 2011 study has demonstrated that 80% of mosques right in this country are teaching jihad warfare and Islamic supremacism.

        Researchers Mordechai Kedar and David Yerushalmi reported in the Summer 2011 issue of Middle East Quarterly about a new survey that found that “51% of mosques had texts that either advocated the use of violence in the pursuit of a Sharia-based political order or advocated violent jihad as a duty that should be of paramount importance to a Muslim.”  Another 30% of mosques in the United States “had only texts that were moderately supportive of violence,” while only “19% had no violent texts at all.”
        http://www.humanevents.com/2011/06/14/most-us-mosques-teach-violence/

        In light of this, were the heinous and traitorous actions of Major Nidal Hasan, “an American who just happened to be a Muslim”, really that surprising?

      • Aside from your link to a reactionary article by a paranoid author how also wrote such even handed articles as “Will Obama Behead Quaran Burners?”… I did a little research.

        Would you also say that churches that tell violent stories from the Old Testament should be closed?

        An your example of Nidal Hassan is a good example of a lone wolf radical muslim.
        But… offering at evidence that all muslims should be denied the right to practice their religion is absurd.

        that’s more absurd than saying all men are guilty of rape

      • You said, “Would you also say that churches that tell violent stories from the Old Testament should be closed?”>>>>

        No I wouldn’t and here is why:
        The difference between the imam in a Mosque that preaches acts of violence in the name of Allah and the Christian preacher that preaches ABOUT the violence described in the Old Testament is that the muslim is prescribing the teachings (the acts of violence) consistently in context–notice the surahs below and many more are PRESCRIPTIVE.

        These are just a few surahs from the Quran Muslims follow that justify their brutal acts of terror:

        “Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible
        that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not (Surah 2:216)

        Terrorize and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an (8:12)

        Slay the unbelievers wherever you find them(2:191)

        Make war on the infidels living in your neighboorhood (9:123)

        When opportunity arises, kill the infidels wherever you catch them (9:5)

        Now let’s look at some scriptures from the Old Testament that many refer to as “violent”. Notice the difference between violence in the bible and violence in the Koran is the difference between DESCRIPTION and PRESCRIPTION. The surahs in the Quran are instructive (PRESCRIPTIVE). However, the verses in the bible are DESCRIPTIVE–they are DESCRIBING historical events that were time specific to the nation of Israel—what happened in the past (I will not include the whole passage for the sake of space. I just want to show the context of the text is past tense).

        Joshua 11—“At that time…” (indicating the past)

        Exodus 32:27-29—“Then he said to them…The Levites did (past tense)

        Joshua 8:24-26—“When the Israelite army finished chasing and killing… (past
        tense)

        Deuteronomy 2:32-34—“…And we took all his cities at that time, and utterly
        destroyed…(past tense)

        1 Samuel 15:7-8—“Then Saul slaughtered the Amalekites from Havilah all the way
        to Shur, east of Egypt. 8 He captured Agag, the Amalekite king, but completely destroyed everyone else. (past tense)

        While all of the bibles prescriptions are described, not all of the descriptions
        are prescribed. The examples above are examples of a DESCRIPTION of the past. This is not a boundless, timeless PRESCRIPTION of how to act.

        Another example of this disparity is how the Old Testament DESCRIBES polygamist relationships, but it does not PRESCRIBE IT.

        Notice the verses in the Quran are instructive (PRESCRIPTIVE) they are not
        DESCRIBING what happened in the past.

        While the Old Testament handled the DESCRIPTION of the past, Jesus (in the New Testament) handled the PRESCRIPTION of how HIS followers should act then, now,and in the future. How did Jesus instruct us how to act?

        Here’s a quick summary of what Jesus PRESCRIBED–how He instructed us to live —

        Matthew 22:36–“Teacher, which is the most important commandment in the law of Moses?”

        37 Jesus replied, “‘You must love the Lord your God with all your heart, all
        your soul, and all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and greatest commandment.
        39 A second is equally important: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 The
        entire law and all the demands of the prophets are based on these two
        commandments

        Romans 12:9–“Don’t just pretend to love others. Really love them. Hate
        what is wrong. Hold tightly to what is good. 10 Love each other with genuine
        affection,and take delight in honoring each other. 11 Never be lazy, but work
        hard and serve the Lord enthusiastically. 12 Rejoice in our confident hope. Be
        patient in trouble, and keep on praying. 13 When God’s people are in need, be
        ready to help them. Always be eager to practice hospitality.

        14 Bless those who persecute you. Don’t curse them; pray that God will bless
        them. 15 Be happy with those who are happy, and weep with those who weep. 16 Live in harmony with each other. Don’t be too proud to enjoy the company of ordinary people. And don’t think you know it all!

        17 Never pay back evil with more evil. Do things in such a way that everyone
        can see you are honorable. 18 Do all that you can to live in peace with everyone.

        19 Dear friends, never take revenge. Leave that to the righteous anger of God.
        For the Scriptures say,

        “I will take revenge;

        I will pay them back,”

        says the Lord.

        20 Instead,

        “If your enemies are hungry, feed them.

        If they are thirsty, give them something to drink.

        In doing this, you will heap

        burning coals of shame on their heads.”

        21 Don’t let evil conquer you, but conquer evil by doing good

        In conclusion, those that commit violence in the name of Allah are adherents (they are not heretics) to the instructions of Islam. However, those that commit violence in the name of God (Jesus) are heretics (they are not adherents) to the instructions of Jesus Christ our Lord.

      • You want islam & sharia law Go Back to Your 3rd world country… Here in Our Christian Nation your are filth & an abomination. You hide behind an Americans photo (Which is obvious to Everyone on this forum) you have stolen & are using without his permission. Rant & Rave until your throat is sore from whining & crying like the Weak tantrum throwing baby that you are. We will NEVER accept you or tolerate your Sadistic cult. You don’t like it here in a Christian Nation… Get Out before you’re shipped out in a Body bag.

      • I’m very sorry to disappoint you, but that picture is me.
        I am a proud patriotic American veteran.
        I do not trace my roots back to the Mayflower… my grandparents came over from Ireland more than 80 years ago.

        unlike you, i am a real patriot who understands the Constitution and understands that our freedoms are for all Americans, even people like you.
        freedom of religion, whether you like it or not, is also for people from other religions than yours.
        Your ranting about how this is a Christian nation goes against everything the Founders believed when they formed this great nation.
        While many of them were Christian men, they founded a nation where all had the freedom to worship (or not) how they choose.

        Also, I am not a Muslim.
        It shows how narrow minded you are that you assume that just because i oppose discriminating against all American muslims I must be Muslim.

        I also oppose discriminating against blacks, discriminating against women, discriminating against jews, and discriminating against old people

        Does that mean you will now assume that I am a black muslim jewish old woman?

        Is standing up for the rights of people not like you something you don’t understand?

      • No, I’m not a Muslim.
        Do you automatically assume that anyone who opposes discrimination against blacks must be black?
        …or anyone who opposes discrimination against gays must be gay?

        I think Islam is a stupid religion.
        but I think people who want to discriminate against all muslims for the actions of a few are behaving in an unAmerican way.

        So you assume that anyone who opposes discriminating against all muslims must be a muslim?

      • Far from stupid. They are achieving their goals in America. “Violence is inherent in Islam–its a destructive nihilistic cult of death, it legitimizes murder” Quote from Ayaan Hirsi Ali, former Muslim that now devotes her time to helping stop Islam and Sharia law in the World. http://wp.me/p2GpDB-cF

      • Muslims have NO Tolerance for anyone but there sadistic, pedophile, Murderous Cult. This is NOT there country!!!! They want sharia law & there sickening beastiality & child raping marriages, they need to go Back to there 3rd world country’s. No one in OUR Christian Nation wants them here, but that Illegal Muslim Communist in OUR White House. Muslims will NEVER force Americans to accept them or abide by there repulsive, abomination cult rules. That is why we refuse to turn in Our Guns… We never will… you picked the wrong Country. The Only president that doesn’t allow your Garbage is Putin! Sad when Americans have to look up to & support a Russian President because we don’t have one of our own. Muslims want to die for Allah, we’ll be more than happy to arrange the meeting. “IN GOD WE TRUST”:

      • Because most all the Mosques are financed by Saudi oil money. Many of them breed terrorists and preach “hate” America. Read this http://wp.me/p2GpDB-cF and google “theprojectmuslimbrotherhood” that is why.

    • Every kid raised in this county , and every adult for that matter, knows how many states we have (this was a constitutional lawyer? that’s scary). He is not of this country

      • You are 100% right. Those who approved him to be put on the ballot should be tried and hung for treason.
        The idiots who voted for him because he looked black are as stupid.

  19. Allen West is 100% correct. Nobody lies awake at night worrying about the Amish. This “religion” is extremely dangerous at this time in history. They DO NOT respect any government. Their “religion” IS their government. Islam literally translated means to surrender. So these people surrender their lives to Allah which is why they are blowing themselves up. Don’t be fooled by so called moderate Muslims. All we have to do is make sure we maintain the integrity of the greatest document ever conceived by man which is our constitution. Our country is the only one in the history of mankind who’s constitution separates church from state. Let’s keep it that way.

      • I agree with you. It took hundreds of years of secular push back to finally stop the church from murdering people for thought crimes.

  20. Stop importing Muslims, cancel all visas of Muslims & escort them out of the country. Get the XL pipeline flowing & stop impeding energy projects. Tell OPEC to ‘BITE ME’ . Have the IRS rescind the tax-free status of Islam. educate Americans on the dangers of the cult and why it is not a religion. Stop granting building permits to new Mosques (Terror Training Centers).
    Reba, This is a start…There are another thousand things that need to be done. But first, we need to recognize the enemy for whom they are.

    • Yes, that is a start, but this Administration isn’t going to do any of it. The American People are asleep or we would be demanding all of the above. Until we can get rid of this Administration, we can’t get anything done. No one can answer the question, why can’t someone do something. Why can’t we arrest the President and Holder for Treason? Why can’t we arrest them for breaking our Laws? Why can’t we arrest all those that are in “Our Government” who are breaking our Laws and putting “Our Country” in danger? Who in “Our Country” can do this?

      • You’re right, this administration, being Islamic itself, wont do anything. Two words come to mind ‘professional Snipers’.

      • Hasn’t happen in six years, so I doubt it will now. I don’t wish it on “Our Country”, but no one can answer my questions on “WHO” in “Our Country” can do something?

      • Yes they are asleep. So many families working two jobs just to survive, raising their children, etc. No time to be involved in the issues, just sad. Read this and pass along. thanks http://wp.me/p2GpDB-cF

      • Yes, people are worn out from 6 years of trying to survive. Thank you for the site and everyone needs to be calling their elected officials about the Muslims, until their phones jam.

    • When one is the POTUS, and congress (especially the dems in the senate) is full of wimps. We need strong leadership from people who are NOT MUSLIM. Wasn’t it Lincoln who said that our country will never be taken from outside but within – well people, we’re seeing it

  21. i think we need to pull together as americans and do something we really need someone to lead, i read that on may 16th. there is suppose to be a lot of americans going to washington, but i haven’t seen anything this past week on it

    • It’s sort of like Occupy DC
      A bunch of people are going to stage a protest and demand that the administration step down.
      Many are planning on staying until their demands are met.

      • You may be standing there till you get so skinny your trousers fall down. The only stepping-down is gonna happen in the voting booth. As far as this administration goes, you’ll be lucky if you see them step down, even in 2016. He’s probably trying to figure out how to stay on a bit longer. But, there’s an election in November; so get the word out for the ones who love the Constitution. And, if you can, send some help to someone’s campaign…even if it’s not in your own state…even if it’s 1 dollar or $2. Really. Anything!

    • The day is coming that Americans, black and white are going to come together and fight for theirfreedom! We have seen a snipet of this already in Nv. with the Feds trying to overtake an American citizen’s property. Many came from far and wide to support him! America may have a weak leader, however, her people remain strong and loyal!

      • There are many good people in America; but we all have to study and spread the message of love for our Constitution “and” Declaration Of Independence. Really!

    • Stella, be carefulwhen you look for a leader. You’ll surely find one…or he’ll find you; but you may be lead somewhere you ought never go. There’s plenty of deceitful people, just waiting for the opportunity to “lead”.

  22. we are witnessing the end of American as we know it ! and are being absorbed into the NWO i.e. the one world government , I’m 74 and have been watching this for 44 years , 99 % of you don’t believe in God , but the rest understand that this is the end of the age , if Israel and Palestine sign the peace treaty, that will be the beginning of the 7 year tribulation

  23. EXCELLENT ARTICLE COLONEL WEST! Thank you for being a voice of logic and reason in a climate of utter stupidity of our current leaders in Washington. We need more patriots like you to stand up to the potential catastrophe of allowing Moslem expansion into Western nations.

  24. “We have fallen under the spell of the bumper sticker “coexist” and have failed to heed the lessons of history.”

    Coexist is the biggest lie since “and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” The idiots that fall for that claptrap are in the business of moral equivalence and somehow equate beheading Daniel Pearl with waterboarding.

    Then you’ve got the apologists in both parties trying to accommodate the Muslim Brotherhoodlums, CAIR and others. You’ve got Clapper calling the MB largely secular. Is he really that stupid or just lying at every opportunity?

      • That has nothing to do with my assertion, and I wouldn’t die for an obsolete, failing religion based on being a weakling, anyway.

      • Nope. Family only.

        I owe the country nothing. The country is a corrupt robber, democrats and republicans alike.

      • Who is asking you to die? Oh, right the Islamists who believe suicide bombing is the means to heaven.

      • It is a lie because it’s not true. But then, Christians don’t die for their beliefs anymore, no. They’ve been watered down.

      • I don’t even know what you’re talking about. How is the Bible factually incorrect and full of internal contradictions? That’s for you to discover for yourself, and for me to enjoy laughing at.

      • The only way for you to NOT know what I’m talking about is to not know what you’re talking about; because I asked you to explain yourself and you didn’t. Don’t worry about it. I’m not interested anymore. That was 3 days ago. If you have a resentment about God or Muhammad,that’s on you. Maybe you got touched-up by a preacher or something. I’m probably not qualified to help you anyway. But, good luck with that. Really!

      • Or, maybe you’re not clear, because your ideas themselves are incoherent, which is far more plausible anyway, because everything you’ve posted I have answered, so long as it was specific. Your problem, not mine.

        And no, I have never been “touched up” (what, like Photoshop?) by anyone like you, sorry, offer declined.

      • Well, you do look like kind of an over-zealous, gullible putz, so I can’t enjoy this TOO much.

  25. When Christian extremists were killing abortion doctors, Christians where outraged even if they were anti abortion. SO …
    Why aren’t Muslims outraged with the killings of innocent people in the name of Allah.
    At 911, I did not read of any Muslim outraged nor at any other time.

    Why are they as a group different than Christians?

    • Because “Christians” have been fed a perverted notion of what “turn the other cheek” means. Actually, I.never weep for a “murdered” murderer. I don’t suggest or recommend doing it; but those extreme people who kill abortionists are not dishonerable or even evil. They’re more frustrated than anything, at the whimsical killing of our most innocent and promising citizens.

  26. You know America is in deep, deep trouble when uninformed
    citizens vote for a BLACK Marxist/progressive/communist/socialist/Islamist president that is willing to allow Muslim Brotherhood members (a terrorist organization by Egypt
    standards, December 25, 2013) into the White House and his administration. You know
    you are in trouble when the BLACK president is being allowed to destroy us
    while a BLACK American military hero is being ignored by the BLACK president
    and he is not being used to stop the formation of a global Caliphate, an Ummah that wants to rule the world by Shariah/Islamic law.
    The Muslim Brotherhood in our government,
    from the White House on down sets policy that sends our military around the world
    to fight and die installing Shariah/Islamic law. The Organization of Islamic Cooperation
    (OIC) is forming a global Caliphate, an Ummah and the Muslim Brotherhood is
    helping and this president is helping them and our useless RINO/GOP refuse to hold hearings in the House and Senate! What is it going to take to wake us up, body bombs in Wal-Mart?

      • I don’t get it! I was showing how two black men think. Obama could walk out of office and millions of us would vote for West.

      • Why not simply ignore the “race” of both? They’re both part of the human race and one is a Marxist, while the other a supporter of the Constitution and BOR.

      • I can agree with it however, will the RACISTS BOTH BLACK & WHITE! Thank you for helping me sharpen the point of my remarks. My point is that America voted for a black man however, he was a Marxists that is using Cultural Marxism i.e. political correctness against us and we do not even know it! Thanks again!

      • Glad to help. 🙂

        And my point is, just the judge both men by their character. No need to add race in any context (IMHO), especially in all CAPS.

        “I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character.”

      • I did it for the impact that we had tow BLACK men that headed down different paths. It worked, I got some comments on it.

  27. I wish Allen West would run for President. We need you Allen. Our Country is being destroyed! Please, please run for President. Then we can have the trash in Congress, the clowns in the CIA who covered up Benghazi and the trash in the IRS, who targeted conservative groups, arrested and thrown in prison. You are the only hope we have for getting our country to go on the right course!

  28. There should be no freedom of a religion that seeks to undermine our founding principles. Ban radical islamicists from preaching their trash.

    • It’s probably not a good idea to allow people with those views into the country or grant them citizenship; but if someone’s already a citizen, they’re guaranteed the freedoms of religion and speech by our Constitution. There can be consequences out-of-court; but…it is what it is. Sometimes someone with a dirty heart, regrets having to keep his hands clean; while someone with a clean heart, regrets having to get his hands dirty.

  29. I have seen a few comments refer to “Muslim Americans” or “Americans that happen to be Muslim.” Let’s clear this rhetoric up now.

    A “Muslim American” is an oxymoron. They can only be “American” in the technical sense of where they reside (quietly and patiently waiting for their numbers to increase)–in America.
    However, if you are using the term as an insinuation of shared American ideals of “All men are created equal (i.e. what undergirds our Civil Rights)”, then you are using the term in the most oxymoronic way. This would be like describing someone as a “Christian Satan worshipper”.

    To the Muslim that adheres to the Koran, an American (that subscribes to our ideals of freedom) is an “INFIDEL”. Therefore, a “Muslim American” (that supposedly shares our ideals of freedom) is actually a “Muslim Infidel”.

    The only way it is possible for a Muslim to be an American in the patriotic (shared ideals of freedom) sense of the term is if the Muslim is not an adherent to the Koran, but a heretic. And if that’s the case, then let’s make sure we refer to them properly, i.e. “Muslim Heretic Americans”.

      • I tend to disagree, as I know of two, one of whom I know personally. They are, Kareem Abdul Jabbar and Muhammad Ali.
        Pretty sure there are others out there {^_^}

      • ALL Muslims are OBLIGATED by the Quran/Haddith/Sunna to wage Jihad against all non-Muslims. If Jabbar and Ali do not, then they are NOT ”’good” Muslims….NOT obeying their Quran. And allah calls them hypocrites, bound for hell. That is fact.

      • True…and I just told you. The QURAN sets the standard for the Muslim. Those who do not comply are not ”’good” Muslims, according to their own authoritative writings.

      • Let’s forget about the Quran. How bout YOU personally? Do you agree with Ewade stating “There is no such thing as a good Muslim either. Unless you count the dead ones.”? That’s what this is about as you responded to my post to him / her.

      • As a Christian I believe that every human being was created in the image of God and someone form whom Christ died. I have pity on Muslims who have been duped into believing the depraved ideology of Islam and as such are enslaved to its hatred for non-Muslims, it’s misogny, hegemony and a life, usually, of poverty.

        I harbor no hatred for any human being, tho I utterly despise Islam and all other ideologies such as Marxism/Communism, etc, which lead men into lives of despair.

        A ”good” Muslim, to a civilized person, is that person who does NOT obey the Quran, but who tries to live in harmony and peace with others. But in Islam, the reverse of that is true.

      • Your testament of your faith / beliefs is fine and dandy but it doesn’t answer the question that I asked you.

    • Correct. According to their Islamic scholars and their own authoritative writings, no Muslim is permitted to pledge allegiance to any nation. …or to even sing a national anthem of loyalty…..which is why no Muslims should ever be in our government, military, police forces, etc.

      Ishaq:204 “‘Men, do you know what you are pledging yourselves to in swearing allegiance to this man?’ ‘Yes. In swearing allegiance to Muhammad we are pledging to wage war against all mankind.’”

    • Yes I know we can vote and hopefully make a start, if that would only get rid of Obama. If we don’t the point may be moot.

      • I don’t think “Our Country” can take 3 more years of this man and his regime. I could be wrong, but I expect this election to have more fraud then the previous two elections. Every day, it is something else and the Bundy Ranch incident should be a wakeup call to what our future is going to be for everyone.

      • What befuddles me is why you think votes matter. If they did or this Kenyan Muslim in the White House wouldn’t be in the White house. We’re way past elections here, folks.

      • My post was to the ones that keep talking about the 2016 Presidential Elections. We need to worry about November 2014 first. Saying that, I believe the 2014 Elections will have more fraud than the two previous elections.

      • I worry more about marshal law before the midterm election.
        Keep your eyes open and an open mind and for damn sure
        keep your powder dry!!!

      • I worried about Marshall Law around May 16, 2014, but now I’m worried about it period, since Bundy Ranch happened.

  30. Wake up America, the Muslim Brotherhood, CAIR and every Muslim organization under the umbrella of the Muslim Brotherhood is not hear to support the Constitution of the United States but to destroy our country from within, President Obama along with several others in office are supporting their efforts.

  31. Let me begin with brandon, I have seen you on the forums here in alot of news areas. I want to ask you something are in the military? Or are you hiding behind a military identification as per your photo? I also notice you speak a bit of broken english which to me makes me think you are not originally from America. I also think you spend more time defending muslims in all your forums as I have been watching you, I find it interesting you spend so much time doing so as you forget to defend the Americans and of course that is if you indeed live here? Stop spending time in defending things you do not know about…as for terrorist groups etc and jihad camps across the usa, you are no expert in this area or are you ????As for the Sgt. I would like to tell you one thing read the USA Constitution that is if you are indeed American…It will remind you we have no montary system our system was made of a credit system. Money has NO real value here technically, so please educate yourself on that information. As for Saudi owning or paying or buying people off so they shut their mouths….I repeat I said before MONEY has no value here, it is up in smoke. So remind yourself they do not own anything here as they do not own our American souls, rememember that .

  32. Let me address Brendan again here …Here is YOUR statement:

    I have stated that radical christians are trying to change our laws and force their beliefs on others.
    Here are some examples (facts)…

    -Anti gay laws based on their religious beliefs
    -So-called religious freedom laws that allow religious beliefs to counter history and science in public schools.
    -Displays of religious icons on public lands and government buildings.
    -Blue laws, prohibiting business on Sundays or sale of alcohol

    -Proposed laws prohibiting other religions from building houses of worship

    My Answers to your falsehoods:

    #1 There is no Anti-Gay Laws, I would like to see them.
    #2 Religious Freedom is in our American Constitution and that is if you went to an American school when you were young, you would know this. Our Pledge as well as our entire constitution is based on God which you will find in many things in America as our money “In God we trust” and our “Pledge Of Allegiance” etc. This is built into our entire country like it or NOT!
    #3 Displaying a cross is not an “Icon” it is a symbol and a reminder of God in this country. For Example the Star and Moon in the Flag of Islam , you may wish to call them icons?
    #4 Sunday is a day of rest which of course is written in the Law of the Land and yes it is based on Law of God. Alcohol as well is included. I am aware that Muslims disagree with drinking it is against their religion.

    #5 There is no laws prohibiting other religions from building houses of worship as you can see it is all around us.

    Let me say this here I noticed that you defend Muslims very agressivly and questions Americans and their laws? I also noticed that you question the religions of America….I wonder are you American? As if you were, I would assume you knew the answers to all the things you question above….The argument is not drawing more attention to you, it almost is insulting to those around you…

  33. We as a nation should be very very scared. We have turned our back on our creator our Lord and God. We have let some of the biggest reprobates walking the face of the earth infiltrate our government. We have put these reprobates in positions of power and influence over our lives. We have discarded God in favor of these scumbags. We need to turn back to our God and ask for forgiveness and his help to rid of of the garbage we have put in office.

  34. Well, just like what Mursi did to Egypt ,Obama is doing to America, Looks like we need to get ready for hell…. They may find Christians a little harder to kill here… and what makes the Government Officials think they are going to be protected, cause Americans will even raise up against them… May be even their own body guards will take it out on them.. But one thing for sure, there is going to be hell for everyone…

  35. We as a nation must return to God Almighty and beg forgiveness. At the very same time get rid of these of islam as they are a poison to our nation.

  36. They have risen up because the liberals think they are peaceful people. Liberlas are fools! Anytine we say something negative( the truth) about muslims, libbies stand up for them.

  37. Dear Col West. I admire you profoundly, and I’m pretty sure that had Romney chosen you as his VP, the 2012 elections would have had a very different outcome.

    But these lines are to remind you of the importance of accuracy in any statement you put out, mainly when dealing with the ideology of deceit. The Strategic Memo was written in 1991, and discovered in 2007. Also equally important is what’s known as “The Project,” which was discovered in Switzerland in 2001 during a raid at the home of a high ranking member of the MB. This document sheds a lot of light on the goals of Islam for the West.

  38. The Explanatory Memorandum was not discovered in 1991, it was written. It wasn’t until 2003 that a MTA officer observed Ismail Elberasse’s wife in full burka taking pictures of the support structure for the Chesapeake Bay Bridge and did a casual traffic stop after she got in the car with her husband that we had cause to search his house. The document was discovered in a hidden sub basement amidst 90 bankers boxes of documents from the Muslim Brotherhood. Sadly, it would not be hidden as evidence in the Holy Land Foundation Trial until 2007.

    I am the author of Stealth Jihad Phase 2: Infiltrate American Colleges.

  39. It is NOT a Religion period! Islam is a violent death cult of teaching pure gate towards others who believe in another religion. This religion opposes all religions, and should be banned in every culture and country. Elimination should be the goal of every country, and in time they will recognize, that is what will have to be done due to the destruction and blood these savage animals spill of innocent people. These disgusting teachings are not humane or modern to a society to prosper in peace. Ear bacon, tell a mussie-turd to get pig stuffed…Fuck Islam and those goatfuckers and child predators!

  40. Islam and Muslims in general are a danger to the US. CAIR is a hateful organization bent on destroying this country’s way of living.

  41. Of course they are with the help of obama. He has loaded our government and military with them and is getting rid of all Americans. Should those who have come here illegally be ousted from our country? Yes! Should obama be impeached? Yes. None of those he is allowing to come into our country are or will ever be loyal to our country but they will be to him. There will never be another America because we have allowed this regime and foreigners to destroy it

  42. The first members of this so called Religion were bought.
    If they joined the religion they wouldn’t have to pay taxes, so they joined.
    Now it ether join or lose your head.
    This is stated pretty simple but that’s the way it works.

  43. Sir, Obama said he will take care of his religion. It was his top priority. He says he is Christian but has only given .03 % to the church of his income? Poleease! He quit citing the Koran after his first year. Do you think someone told him not cool?
    There are few Muslims where I live. I called them out when they came to purchase goats from me. The older gentleman that purchased believed very much the same as I do. He says the BAD Muslims are Fanatics. I will never believe as they do. To come to the USA means tolerance. No you or me, just us.
    Obama has advertised that he has cut military spending. Presenting us as weak to the world. We are not weak.
    This is why he is attacking the 2nd amendment. To make us weak. Does he really think all Americans are gay retards with no brain cells at all?
    This countries people will soon see what is going on, we need men like you to lead the rally.
    Obama and the bad ones are making this into a race thing. My children are mixed and it pisses me off when they are referred to as African-Americans
    They are Black-Americans!
    After
    JFK was murdered, LBJ said he would have all of the n*****s voting democrat for the next 200 years. That was in 1965. Why did he say that? Why are blacks voting for these haters now?
    I do not understand.

    • The problem with Nobama is he surrounds himself with gay retards and believes everybody else is also that way…. He is deluding himself and continues to do so and Valery Jarrett keeps blowing smoke up his butt and all is great in his mini mind world….

    • Kat, “Black-Americans” is a trap too. And, that’s what’s makes it easier for them to be manipulated by the Progressives. For instance, Obama didn’t get elected because of the “content of his character”; but “only” by the color of his skin. He has absolutely nothing in common with Americans with black skin. He likes to act like he’s “down with the struggle”; but he’s a spoiled brat child of privilege, who has done nothing but destroy any positive advances in race relations that he possibly could. Everything is about his attempt to advance his political aspirations by igniting and fanning a spark of recism in the people who trusted him to do just the opposite. All those Democrats. I, myself…used to not know any better. When I was a kid, I was a registered Democrat, too. But I found out it’s the party of the KKK. Until FDR black-skinned Americans always voted Republican. Then came the “New Deal”; and a whole lot of people, of all groups , sold out or got bought off or got suckered into the Democratic party. Then…yeah Kat, LBJ! The Democrats were so good to the black Americans! They gave them those nice little housing projects (so they could have ’em all in one place, where they could keep an eye on ’em). And now, of course, we have “Rev” Al, and the likes of him, helping out with the racism; so any time someone tries to help folks get out of there…he calls them a racist or an Uncle Tom. ‘Reverend”, my behind! But, of course the “establishment” Democrats (and the “Progressive” Republicans) treat Ol’ Al like he’s something real special. ..even though everybody knows he’s a lowlife slimy, racist, opportunist. Why would they treat him that way? Because he’s doing their job for them. Dr. King was a Republican for a reason. But, he was a “real” Republican…not one of these “Progressive” Republicans we have in Washington. I mean, there’s only a handful of Republicans left. I’m talking about the ones who love our Constitution and want to “conserve” it. But then the Progressives try to re-define the meaning of the word “Conservative” into something they can all agree on hating. The so-called “Republicans” really hate the Conservative Republicans too; but they can’t agree with the Progressives’ re-defined definition; because they have to call “themselves” Conservatives in order to have the support of their base. Yep. It’s a sick game they play, Kay; and everybody’s got to learn to think for themselves. I don’t even want anybody to trust me. If they do trust me, without knowing themselves…the next one the talk to, is just gonna turn them around, anyway. It seems all we can do is pray for wisdom and warn our kids.

  44. How blessed and healing it would have been for America, if our first black President had been a good, righteous and wise man; leading us as one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all—and there are many who could have fulfilled that promise: Dr. Ben Carson, Ambassador Alan Keyes, and Ltc. Allen West; to name a few.

    …Instead what we elected was a half-black, common stre…et punk: who was taught as a child to hold America in deep contempt, who has used the power of government to exact revenge on a nation which he perceives wronged his ancestors, who intentionally put into motion forces designed to destroy the nation’s economy, whose lawless regime has made a mockery of our Constitution, who has intentionally created a climate of hostility between races of people, and whose arrogance and stupidity is leading the world closer to nuclear war than it has ever been.

    America choosing Barack Hussein Obama as it’s leader in 2008, was as much an act of national suicide, as if Israel had chosen Yasser Arafat as it’s leader in 1988.

    There is no longer a viable political solution to the Obama dilemma, because our voting process has been usurped by twenty million illegals, and by millions of Muslims who know that Obama is one of their own—our true hope lies in the mercies of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the resolve of freedom loving Americans, and the patriots still within our military.

    Lord God, have mercy upon America! a nation birthed in rebellion against a tyrant, a nation ordained as a light to the nations. Yet today, a nation that has learned to call evil good, and good evil; a nation awash in the innocent blood of fifty million unwanted children, a nation burning incense to pagan idols—Spare our nation for YOUR own sake, and the gospel’s; deliver us from the curse of Barack Obama, and give to our nation the spirit of repentance and revival in greater measure than we have known before. We plead this in Jesus name.

    Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord. Psalm 33:12

    • Obama’s got nothing to do with the Black struggle in this country. He’s a spoiled brat and was born a child of privilege. He has no Black ancestors who lived in this country. The only thing he has in common with American Blacks is the color of his skin. His skin color is his favorite excuse for all his failings; but that’s actually comical. The color of his skin is the only good thing about him.

    • Liberals/Progressives tend to look down their nose at anyone who doesn’t agree with them. News Media people think they’re real smart because they’re delivering the news…as if they’re “enlightening” everyone. But, they know deep down that they aren’t so smart and are afraid to think on their own; so they choose to delude themselves and live the life of a magpie.

      • Speaking of Magpies, check out the following video for a good laugh {^_^}

        Only in the remotest parts of Australia…………….

        …….are you ever likely to witness something like this!

        The crazy bird is a WILD Australian Magpie and the dog looks like a domestic Jack Russell.

        Link: http://www.youtube.com/embed/qoaEBb4IN4Q?rel=0

      • I didn’t say it is a Jack Russell. That link was sent to me by a friend down in OZ and she captioned it. BTW, what breed of dog do you think it is?

      • What gets me…how can they keep throwing the “Race Card” at EVERYTHING and not cause an “overload” even w/their “followers”? I’d be saying, by now, “What ISN’T racist?…What ISN’T a lie?”…I’d bee looking to see just WHAT the “otherside” was saying to judge for myself…how can they be Racist/Liars ALL the time?

      • Obama’s cry of “racism!”, any time someone disagrees with him, is quite cowardly, it’s racist, it shows his inability to take responsibility for his own mistakes and shortcomings and it’s also an insult to anyone with the same skin color as he has. After all…the color of Obama’s skin is the only good thing about him.

    • Yeah, Jersey! “You” have to be the “News Media”. You and me. I’m in CT…friend me on Facebook. Hey! Strength in numbers…share ideas and all that.

    • It may come to that. Obumma I have read is a member of the muslime brotherhood. Even if that isnn’t true he’s too closely related to islime. A video I saw had he saying the muslim call to prayer was the most beautiful thing he’s ever heard. Overall he sure isn’t doing anything to actually protect this nation from such slime..

    • Gotta spread the word, Tex. Make sure you warn the kids that they’re gonna be lied to in school. Talk to your friends. Hey, friend like-minded people on Facebook. Pass on any news you find out. If there’s a thread about something you can talk straight about…put your 2cents in. Hey, you can friend me on Facebook…and if you can share some political thoughts…well, send it in.

  45. Obama is a muslim and will do everything to promote muslims and Islam. The dumbed down American public won’t realize it until is too late. SAD!!

    • It’s a race against time. We have to do all we can to wake them up. It seems this “common core” is another way of making the kids stupid , so they can be more easily manipulated. The colleges “really” make the kids dumb. I mean common sense-wise. There’s even so-called “Phd.s”, writing history books that are total…like, they make it up as they go along. Even with the Constitution…they change words, they change punctuation or sentence structure, so they can interpret it how they want; and teach that to the kids. And, these schools get hugh tuitions for that. One thing that can be done to combat the Progressive perversion of education is for people to start suing universities for teaching bogus information. I’m not a lawyer; but I’m sure it would fly. Then they’d have to straighten up. And, also try to sue these phoney professors, too. What they do is like mental molestation; and they should be held accountable. Hey, they’re taking a lot of money and selling a faulty product. And, the evidence to prove it is right there in the text books.

  46. There has never been any condemnation from This administration for any
    Islamic act of Terror. If you listen close you will hear the silence of Death
    to all Christians because it is what the Muslim do! Plain and simple you wont
    know until the moment just before they kill you and cut off your head because
    that’s what they do. Obama wont even acknowledge Islamic Jihad exists!!!

  47. The Liberals don’t care anymore they have morphed into lock
    step with the Muslim Brotherhood!! In order to fundamentally change this nation
    Obama and his crew Chicago Gangster Politics must destroy all organized
    opposition to the new rule of law!

    Both the Leftist and Muslim are willing to do what ever it
    takes to bring this nation down!

      • Actually, in the 2008 election…wehad Job Biden, who’s the phoniest thing since hair plugs…we had “Cross-the-Aisle” Johnny McCain, whos bi-partizan way of doing things, seem to have become a template for Obama’s strategy in dealing with Putin…and then we “had” the hitherto unknown; but nonetheless… “All New…All Electric” Barack Obama (of whom, although still much the mystery, we have since become acquainted).Drum roll, please! But, serseriously…Sarah Palin was and “is” the most qualified and capable of the four, to be President. And it wouldn’t surprise me at all, if she would have been (and could be) an excellent President. Probably the best since Ronald Reagan. But certain corners of the country scream hard about a woman, if she doesn’t submit.

    • One thing that can help, though, is that your standard (right out of the box) Liberal can’t stand the sight of blood. That’s why the Progressives do everything they can to hide pictures of any carnage the Muzzies cause. They go nuts to hide abortion photos, too. They showed some nasty Vietnam pics., because they wanted to end the war; but abortion and jihad…they don’t want the “Uninitiated” Libs. to see too much of that.

  48. The moderate Muslim is one who will not cut off your head
    but will turn their head away so they don’t have to see your head removed!!
    This is true definition of moderate Islam!!
    It is also the definition of Barrack Hussein!

    • I don’t believe for one minute that Obama is a MODERATE…not by any stretch of the imagination…but he IS practicing al taquiyya…the lying sanctioned and rewarded by allah to be used to gain the trust of the infidel, to use against him at a later, more advantageous time. He is a fraud who had to be convincing so he claimed to be a Christian (while denying the fundamental tenets of the faith) and has sworn allegiance to America, while slowly spreading the disease that will ultimately kill us. Since day one in the Oval Office, he has been aiding and abetting the enemy.

      A time will come when he will reveal his true colors as an ardent, Quran-believing Muslim, and I hope that happens in a courtroom when he is being tried for treason.

  49. A question to the Muslim?
    Silence is the same as compliance in their world. That damn
    book they read! When you know your profit is a pedophile and lays with
    animals yet you still follow then what is to be done with you!!

    • Good question. Mo is said to be ”the Perfect Man” for all Muslims to emulate. He was a liar, thief, slaver, rapist, torturer, murderer, pervert and pedophile. So what does that say about those who follow him?

      • I’m still wondering what they’re gonna do with all those virgins, after they lose their wankers in a body bomb explosion.

      • One must wonder about the genocidal tendencies in a book in which God drowns all, even children and the unborn. But wait, that’s the Bible! Silly me.

      • Oh yeah, sure. God can do whatever he wants, so it’s automatically okay. I guess if God’s morality can’t be judged, then neither can the morality of his fan club. I guess that’s how they happen upon their moral blank checks. Christians can do as they please, and no matter what, they’re only one prayer away from moral perfection.

        No, thanks. Your god is worthless to me, and I don’t need his “rules”, especially since it is painfully obvious he isn’t around to enforce them.

      • God is perfect in every way. You and I are not. We can only know Him because He has chosen to reach down to us and reveal Himself….in the witness of conscience, the witness of nature, and, in the life of His Son, and in His Word. You have chosed to ignore or reject the evidence of His existence.

        You use the word, ”worthless”, which is a value judgment. Your problem is that without an objective standard (according to your atheistic relativism) you have no authority to judge anyone. All behavior is equal in the atheist’s world…..whether it’s that of Mother Theresa or Joseph Stalin.

        In the atheist’s universe there can be no compelling ”oughts” to guide your behavior because it is a closed system of natural physical causes. Actually in such a world there could be no freedom of choice, even, since all behavior would be determined by random, mindless chemical processes. So….morality in the world of Colman Webster would be a concept without a reference point. No ”moral truth” can exist in such a world since there could be no transcendent standard by which we could measure our conduct.

        At the very least, an honest atheist would admit that the moment he makes a moral claim or invokes moral ”law”, he violates his own world view.

      • It’s not any sort of “moral claim”, first of all, it’s simply an opinion that is probably more valid at a statistical level.

        Second, I am more valuable than any god, primarily because I exist, first and foremost. That’s more than I can say for any god/s, and especially yours.

        Third, you don’t know anything about an “atheist’s world”, whatever that even means, so don’t even pretend.

        The only thing I reject is lies, and that includes Christianity, a massive historical and scientific fraud.

        According to Christian relativism, anything is evidence for God, so long as the evidence can be be bent and distorted to fit a preconceived religious worldview. Not buying it.

    • That damn book they read, where a father sleeps with his two daughters, after they get him drunk! Oops, sorry, that’s the BIBLE. My bad.

  50. It may sound wildly speculative, but supposing CAIR is supported by those holding the highest offices in the land. Sounds like the plot to a fiction thriller. That could make cowards quake in their boots.

  51. I think a lot of politicians, and people are taking pay offs. Why else would they side with CAIR, the unindicted co-conspirator of the Holy Land Terror trial? Why would a Jewish college side with CAIR? It is either pay offs or fear of terrorism.

    • No more a double standard than humanists under the forms of communism, nazi-ism obamism, and the like get a free pass for the millions murdered for the “greater good”.
      Try to act like Jesus Christ, fail repent repeat. There are many that try to live up to Christ, but all of us can easily live down to Muhammad or stalin.

    • The MAIN difference is,……… the Christians stopped with the violence centuries ago … !

      muslim Pigs are STILL cutting of the heads of people they don’t like to this very day!

      sondra you really are a super idiot … !!!!!

  52. Kill all muzzies, wipe any record of their existence off the face of the planet. This includes women, children, anyone and everyone associated with the damn muzzies.
    These people are our enemies for petes sake. They’ve killed tens of thousands of people around the world. They are fundamentally incapable of being happy with their existence, and as a result they must, and I repeat MUST make everyone just as miserable. This is what Jihad is all about. Even in country’s that are 90% muzzie, they still need to feel superior, so they attack their women, Christians, any one not toeing the line of the dime store novel Koran.

  53. Sorry Alan, while I agree with the premise these people are not “Islamists” they are MUSLIMS. Pure and simple. There is no need for PC when discussing Muslims. They are not “radical Muslims”, “Islamists”, “muslim extremists” or “jihadists”. They are Muslims doing what Muslims do, and it is anathema to our way of life and our system of laws. They do not belong here and should be sent back to whatever hell hole they ran from.

  54. Its way past time to deport from the top down,I would wager that a large percent of these folks are here illegally yet nobody does nothing to correct this problem,its no different from the Mexican problem its still way past time to deport if they want to come back they should be investigated no questions about it,that’s just part of the process,if they fail these checks they don’t come back

  55. Their dog is in the White House, it seems and is hunting just fine. This needs to be rectified. Obama and Holder and thugs should be in prison.

  56. I love how this site removes posts that disagree with their views. You know how the Taliban dominates who they invade, they stop anyone who disagrees with their views. Sad that it’s being done but that’s your right.

  57. You’re preaching to the choir here! I live in a west Texas town and I’ve noticed the influx of muslims the last few years! The elderly ones are still subdued and respectful, the younger ones however are defiant in their demeanor! They’ve been here since 1982 but to their credit they haven’t turned our town into Dearborn yet! ODERINT DUM METUANT!

  58. Ya’ll have probably heard this before. Remember when we played Cowboys and Indians? We ain’t played Cowboys and Muslims yet.

  59. Political Correctness has run amuck and must be condemned for the negative force it is. Remember, Allah is Satan’s other name! Satan is strongest and does most damage when people do not believe in him!

  60. Love it – apparently the English have grown some huevos recently as they just threatened the brotherhoods office in London with an investigation into their activities and like the cockroaches the muslim brotherhood truly is they packed up and are scurrying off to some other dark corner – like Austria – i believe this is an agenda – if you include this along with all of the other attacks this ” administration ” is involved directly as well as indirectly on Christians as well as facilitating anyone else who attacks Chrsitians the world over this acquiescence to these psychopaths starts to make more sense – Christianity is one of the foundations this country was built on it guides our moral compass – which is why this country for all intents is a ship with no one at the helm in the middle of a storm – Thats exactly what the people want who are out to destroy this country – You’re absolutely right islam has been about world conquest since day one – it has;nt changed one bit – not a bit – For the people with their ” co-exist ” bumper stickers i say go show that to muslims – they’re the ones not wanting to PEACEFULLY co-exist – Then kick every last one of them out of this country until every muslim country starts allowing Christian churches to be built in their countries – Yeah – like that will ever happen – So i say deport EVERY LAST ONE OF THEM –

      • yeah i know i’m aware of it – scary is what it is that its not being dealt with appropriately – how many camps are there now training militants that are going to go out and kill whoever they can? and nothings being done about it – have you looked at Gellers work on Atlas Shrugged? shes good too –

  61. We need a Joe muslim-masher McCarthy willing to root out the islamists from where ever they pitch their tent. We need people like Allen West who are willing and able to flush them from under whatever rock they squat. I applaud Allen West’s ability to smoothly, calmly and with great depth of knowledge of the islam control system when he takes down any islamist willing to debate him on the finer points of that repugnant, degrading, denigrating, fascist system of control. Allen West is a great leader and a true American patriot!

  62. since obammy got elected,the U.S. has been shipping in 250,000 muslim somali’s a year,and take a guess where they put these people,they spread them out in those so called up for grab states,ohio,michigan,wisconsin.then at voting time,they drive all these somali’s to the voting booths and help them pull the lever marked democrat

  63. All muslims must be kicked out of America or there will be no America in the future. Obama is a muslim and is destroying America from WITHIN. The People will rise up!~

  64. we do have people in this country that are sounding the alarm about islam in america,but the mainstream media jump all over them with all kinds of accusations,liberals will only go after the christian religion,when it comes to the muslims,it is all hands off,they are terrified of this islamic religion,just like that clown bill maher,he makes fun of the christian religion on a daily basis,but he never even mentions the muslims,he is a disgusting coward,just like all the libs and media in this country

  65. Facebook has already joined the Obama crowd by banning those who write anything bad about Islam, even though … given most of our upbringing … can judge by the actions of the Islamic Terrorists and studying their laws that their one and only goal is to “convert or kill” all Americans who refuse to convert!!! IF one considers this a religion that is acceptable to America, then they should grab one with each hand and immediately leave out for their home ground! I am 71 years old and have paid my dues to America and I am sick and tired of the Americans on their butts, playing Ostrich, with their heads up ‘it’ and refusing to see and hear the truth! “allah” may be God to them, but, as a professing Christian, he is “Satan” to me and should be to all Christians. Your religion is(or should be) by choice and not by force and death for refusing to accept it.

  66. part 2: I am readying one article to post on my Facebook page, along with this one, and see if they ban me. Since they have joined Obama and ban those who might say something derogatory about Islam, documented truth or not!!! Naturally, given his unearned yet appointed position, he has that legal right to hinder Free Speech as he sees fit!

    • If they ban your post again, spread the word and maybe thousands will start dropping off. I’m rarely on Facebook and only post to family and friends and nothing political.

      • I will be sure to do that. However, The “Ostrich” that I mentioned below really need to have a “real” source of ALL the news and not just the “biased” news. In truth, all of this is OUR FAULT. The Constitution was designed and written for US to see that the government stood behind it. Even though, as today, our Government Officials” swear on the Bible(not the Koran or what have you) when the take office and to purposely “bypass” the Constitution, to me, moves you into the position as a Traitor and the results should quickly follow!! Obama is raising an Army because he knows that sooner or later it won’t only be the South that rises again. This was planned when Washington did away with the Anti-American Activities Commission and openly allowed the CPUSA(Communist Party)!! As with man, he can slowly be poisoned to death and never know it, until it’s too late. Yet, if you start beating him in the head with a hammer, unless he’s a total idiot, he will know that you’re trying to kill him!! Like the Ostrich, with it’s head hidden, you could cut it off before he/she knew it.

      • “Even though, as today, our Government Officials” swear on the Bible(not the Koran or what have you)”
        Surprise, the Congressman that represents the 5th Congressional District in Minnesota, took the oath of office with his hand / cloven hoof on the Koran!!

      • AND I will bet that it was never mentioned in the government controlled/censored media outlets. That is the exact reason that I have the sites like this to view. Theoretically and by government law states that any government official takes the oath on a Holy Bible. It does not mention any other religious book or material. THIS will definitely go down in my files. If you will, post his name for me. Thanks

      • BOO! How are you? Trying to finish taxes, ug! We also have bad storms coming in. I’ve been on Freedom outpost mostly, about the Bundy Ranch. I can’t believe West hasn’t post one article about it.

      • Ours started moving in this afternoon. This weather is crazy, but rain is always good, except for the flooding. How was your weekend?

      • I read where they want to use the march on washington to divert attention away from Clive Bundy’s ranch so they can take him over while our back is turned

      • Yep and this article is good. Hell of a note, isn’t it?
        I just posted it again above and it should work.

      • yes it worked. Well forewarned is forearmed and as long as they know people can revisit the confrontation and hopefully make it backfire on them

      • Yes, as long as they can get there in time. I think they will cut off communications, prior to going in. They will also be many more and more weapons the next time. They finally talked about Harry Reid today on Fox and he made a statement: It’s not over!

      • He is slap dab in the middle of it. He is totally corrupt, along with his son and others. Is that what you are asking me?

      • Yes, keeps getting deeper and deeper. From Harry Reid: “Well, it’s not over. We can’t have an American people that violate the law and then just walk away from it. So, it’s not over.”

      • Yes, keeps getting deeper and deeper. From Harry Reid: “Well, it’s not over. We can’t have an American people that violate the law and then just walk away from it. So, it’s not over.”

      • Yes they did as he makes no bones about it. In case you didn’t know, here in Minneapolis, we have the largest population of Somalis in the United States and have an area of the city with the nickname of Little Somalia!! Bet you can’t guess who they vote / voted for?

      • I had forgotten that about Minneapolis. I guess you have two choices, take your home back or move. Neither is easy.

      • This ain’t my home. Just biding my time here till I start drawing my retirement. This crap would never happen in my home {^_^}

      • I hope it goes by fast for you. 🙂
        God willing and the creek don’t rise.
        One of my favorite sayings (Southern)

      • How true! Being a Native Southern gal, I can tell you we have not lost our passion for Freedom and what is right. I know there is a lot of Patriots around “Our Country” that feel the same way. They are just stuck where they are, because of jobs or lack of funds to come South. I believe “The People” are slowly waking up and hopefully it will not be to late when they do open their eyes. This is not over by a long shot and it’s scary and sad.

      • I’ve experienced that on this site, too. Sometimes my responses don’t show up where they’re supposed to be, on the thread; but instead they go onto the page you get when you click-on my photo. There must be a ideologue working on this site.

  67. The problem is that almost no one can really grasp the ultimate truth behind Obama’s program … what ever their goals, so long as they aren’t White and what they are doing is against the White part of America and he can take from Whites and give to this or that group, Obama will give them whatever support they need. Crushing White America is the goal.

    No lofty world changing all loving and peaceful future … no for the good of all mankind … no bringing people together … it is about the color of their (WHITES) skin and that being the sign of the content of their character. He’s the Anti-“Martin Luther King”. Whites must be crushed and that is all. Nothing more. Obama is behind anyone who is down with that goal … whatever the cost. Da Crackers Got Ta Go.

    • He’s definitely a racist. No doubt about it; but it’s bigger hate than “Crushing White America”. He’s a spoiled brat; so perhaps little Barry has one of those “deep-seated resentment” things goin’ on with his Mommy (his White side). Perhaps he’s pissed at her for not taking him to the doctor’s when he was a kid, to get his ears fixed, so he wouldn’t look like a wing nut.

      • For the past eight years I’ve been wondering what he looks like and wing nut describes him to a tee hee {^_^}

      • Its too bad they’ve done such a spectacular job of hiding all the speeches Michelle made on this subject (Critical Race Theory). Listening to that sort of abject hate is something that would wake everyone up to the peril we face from these people.

  68. EVERYBODY! Google “Operation American Spring”. Support it, spread the word, and join us in Washington, D.C. on May 16th! It’s time for some serious changes!

  69. America’s worst mistake overall with Islam is, we became tolerant of the intolerant, and appeasers of those who refuse to appease.

  70. I’m a few days late on this. I opened it in a new tab and I just had to leave it up until I got a little bit of free time and boy am I glad I did. Mr. West you are a true patriot. I’m ashamed at what our once great country has been reduced to. This is a truly beautiful story. I wish the US people would wake up and open their eyes before it’s too late. Sadly I don’t think the masses will. Like you said this problem can be entirely traced back to the “political correctness” that’s been pushed on those who are uninformed and of weak mind.

    It’s true you shouldn’t judge a man/women based on their skin color or their religion, however Liberals have twisted the saying to you can’t judge somebody because of their skin color or religion. It’s sickening. They’ve also twisted the old saying that “all men are created equal.” That saying is 100% true, however they twist it and try to convince people that all men are equal (which is definitely not 100% true.) Yes we might have equal rights but that’s where it ends. At birth we are all equal, no sin, no mistakes, it’s what we do from there that we are judged.

  71. Sure wish this guy was in charge of our country rather than the Islamic Muslim we have in the White House. Definitely would be a safer America.

  72. Yes Americans are asleep. John Adams, our 2nd President, saw Muslims and Islam for what it really is, a whack job of a religion.Islam is not compatible with Americans.Islam, NOT RADICAL iSLAM IS OUR ENEMY. READ THE Koran FOLKS. Islam wants to subjugate all religions and free people.When the right of free religion exists it means religion is not forced by the government. People can force religion from this country.Its time to get nasty with all muslims.

    • It “is” happening. And, you can be sure, he’s trying to figure-out how he could somehow get a little extension on his stay. After all. . .it’s such a drag, moving.

      • Do you think Obama’s gonna worry about things boiling over? He may just want that; so he can have his “hands full ridding ourselves” of “us”. Now we have all these yahoos goin’ to DC. There’s nothing he’d like better than an excuse to confiscate all the guns he could find. All he needs is some nucklehead with a gun, in the crowd (even one he plants there), to have an excuse to let loose the federal troops on them. (And the media would back him up) And don’t think he won’t. That’s why he fired all the top generals he didn’t think would pucker-up. It’s never gonna be a choice between us and the Muzzies. We better understanding that he already made “that” choice, a long time ago.

      • Joe, you might try clicking on the reply link directly under the statement from the person you want to reply to. Only then will your replies show up in the correct location.

      • Sorry, Max! I just wrote you a thankyou note; but when I did what you suggested, I losy the post all together. LOL! Thanks anyway, though! I’d just hate to think we had a mole. I don’t have a PC; so I have to poke-out these posts, one letter at a time on my phone. Grrr! Thanks, Max!

      • Your response showed up under my explanation so you did it correctly. I don’t have a phone just a pc. I’ve found that sometimes replies take awhile to show up. Good luck.

  73. I don’t think we’re all asleep. But this administration is purposely looking the other way – which makes it worse than being asleep. There are plenty of people holding stored-up anxiety and concern for America. In the not-too-distant future, this energy might spill over, and then Obama – and our country – will have our hands full ridding ourselves of this enemy. I pray this scenario never happens, but the other half of our citizens are fat, dumb, and, they say, happy. And are uninformed, or worse, unconcerned. Why should they? Their man(?) is in charge. (wink, wink). Until getting a bigger SUV or house than you becomes less important than the 40 miles of bad road ahead, we’re in for a rough ride… Wake up!

  74. What do you propose Mr West? Abandoning the 1st amendment by restricting free speech? We’ve already abandoned the constitution by using the military/CIA for geopolitical/militarist/corporatist interests instead of the defense of OUR borders. These actions by our govt have manifested into losses of civil liberties and unwarranted (and over-hyped) threats to Americans.Your fear mongering for more support of the police state and foreign interventions is laughable. Since the annihilation of 200 million Islamists is impossible, please explain how further intervention in the middle east will eliminate more enemies than it creates? Our Constitution has protected us from communism, and it will protect us from sharia too.

    • The Constitution isn’t supposed to protect you, knucklehead! You’re supposed to protect “it”. This is why there is the Oath to protect and defend the Constitution. If these pantloads in the White House, the DOJ and the Congress and the Progressive courts make their life’s work to mold it’s interpretation into a reflection of their own weakness, you’ll see a lot more of all those things you listed. But, you sound by your last sentence that “everything’s just fine. The Constitution will protect us.” You stick your head in the sand or up your butt and think all’s well. The thought of those who would do away our rights or of a Muslim threat scares some people. Yes. But others are such cowards they scream as loud as they can that all is well; because it’s just to terrifying for them. Something they can’t prove, like Global Warming (or is it temperature change…indeed)…they’re all over it; but what Allen West is speaking of is “very” verifiable. Have you ever seen a Holocaust Denier? Look in the mirror. Another pantload.

      • First of all, the Constitution’s bill of rights does just that! It protects our God given natural rights and property from tyranny, no matter who is dealing it out. When conservatives and liberals subvert the laws that were designed to limit the federal govt, we get welfare, non-defensive wars, social security, medicare, a myriad of useless Depts of _____, the federal reserve, the Patriot Act, TSA, the criminalization of “some drugs”, immigration problems, and false threats of “enemies” abroad that are entirely created by the govt. All these subversions are used to redistribute wealth at gun point for the benefit of politicos, banks and corporations, and NOT American citizens. An informed, armed populace described by the 2nd amendment should the choice over any govt to feel secure in your home. But then, a chicken like you would prefer your rights stripped in the name of security from some fake threat. Look in the mirror, another statist clown wearing pu55yboots.

      • Why not try reading West’s post, and spare us your self-agrandizing bullshite. He’s not advocating denying anyone’s 1st Ammendment rights…he’s saying to use them and stop pretending that nothing’s happening. And the Bill of Rights won’t ptotect anything if you let it get whittled away, sliver by sliver; because you’re afraid of talking out about those who would do that. Go ahead and defend the Muzzies and critize West. But you really should try reading his post again, before you say any more stupid sh t about him.

      • I’m not defending “muzzies”, (your bigoted choice of words),
        I’m defending everyone’s right to free speech and to petition the govt, including everyone from the KKK to Christians. “Complaining” about those rights from an elected official is counter to the Constitution, West should know better. The “letting it get whittled away” you speak of is exactly what you, West, the GOP and liberals have endorsed or accomplished over the last 150 years. The GOP claims it is the party of the Constitution, but it is as complicit as the Dems in “whittling it away”. The GOP has no principles or constitutional guidance anymore. It has been hijacked by theocracy, war mongering, homophobia,
        the police state, and chrony-capitalists. They have no problem criminalizing or discriminating behaviors that do no harm to others nor do they mind killing innocent civilians in countries that pose ZERO threat to Americans. Good luck winning another election with that platform. Until the GOP flushes the likes of you and West, it will continue to go by way of theWhigs, and rightly so.

      • So it’s “bigoted” to say, Muzzies. Candyass should I say the “M” word. Like I said…read what West said. He’s not saying to take anyone’s rights away. You’re just another hypocrite. Just like Obama…anyone who doesn’t agree with him is a recist. Now you accuse West of trying to take away someone’s rights. Grow a pair, pal. That’s a pair of eyes! Gotcha! Really…readhis post, before you go accuse somebody. You don’t really want to be like Obama. BTW…that other stuff you say about Republicans(not all; but most) is true. They’re almost as bad as the Dems., they’re just going a little slower. But you use too wide of a brush…and you’re too hot headed. Don’t say West is saying something he’s not. You don’t like when it’s done to you. Do you?

      • Then please explain this comment:
        “How is it that an organization like the Council for American Islamic Relations (CAIR) is even allowed to exist in our Republic?”

      • Again…read the post. CAIR are sworn enemies of America and ought not be let into this country in the first place. Its not about free speech. They should be practicing their free speech from their own countries. If you read what he’s saying, he doesn’t understand “how CAIR is allowed in this country in the first place”, you might know that. He doesn’t say anything about Muslim-Americans or even people from Muslim countries. Did you hit the link and read their memorandum?

      • Using your logic, we should bar any pro-Israel group from operating in America since they bring NOTHING but problems and retaliation to us citizens.

      • I posted that to soon, by mistake. Anyway after you read the memo…if you think CAIR or anyone involved with it should be allowed into this country, I’m sure I can’t do anything for you. Hoe about the kGB or during WW2…Hitler’s SS? And, like West said…the Progressives will want to make it a 1st Ammendment issue.

      • His point is that it is an organization that objects to our constitutional rights and wants to REPLACE our Constitution with Sharia law. Today there is a video clip of a Muslim woman from this group involved in politics – no one stops her by the way – who shows the viewer along with a smug democrat how she gets things done to further their agenda and squash anyone who disagrees. Pathetic pandering men surround her. They obviously live in fear of annoying them.

      • Well, we ought to think about “not allowing” Democrats and Republicans to exist for their usurpation of the Constitution also.

    • You are apparently blind to the fact the Constitution no longer guides our Socialist/Communists rulers who simply ignore it when it suits them. Our tyrant in Chief has aliened himself with the Muslim Brotherhood who function as advisors in the White House and are in Homeland Security in powerful positions to determine policy such as border control or the lack thereof. Common Core, the illegal Federal intrusion into education extolls the virtue of Islam, while rewriting American history in a not so patriotic terms. it also has revised the contents of the Constitution, e.g. teaching that the second amendment allows guns for some people, such as the police and the military, but not everyone. Political correctness has shut down free speech to the point where a terrorist cutting down soldiers on a military base while yelling Allah Akbar is just a disaffected worker.

      • When the GOP starts non-defensive wars, expands Medicare, runs up debt, criminalizes or discriminates behaviors that do no harm to others, then you get the Dems subverting the Constitution for their purposes. See the pattern?

      • Very good!! OUR Constitution has never meant anything to the Communists or the Muslims … in or out Washington and/or the U.S.!

    • Sadly, it has not protected us from Communism … refer to “The 45 Communist Goals for America(submitted into the Congressional Record) and see that the majority of them have been passed down to “We the Sheeple” in some form of government rule, law, program, etc. Also, check out “The Communist Manifesto” and notice their specific ‘guidelines’ for overtaking a country. Consider that we fought and died any many places ‘supposedly’ trying to prevent the expansion of Communism/Socialism!!

      • With that being said, maybe we should look at both Republican and Democrat parties as being the enemy since they’ve allowed this to happen.

      • There are really more problems being caused by “We the Sheeple” being dependent on Washington for the truth, when there is none. Also, the Church has failed its people by teaching selective scripture and refusing to take a stand when Washington first started their “restrictions” on the Christian religious activity outside of the church. Washington maintained segregation while they continued ‘pushing’ intergration, in order to keep the two races apart. The Blacks accomplished gaining rights by their movement in the ’50s-’60s and we Whites refused to see and realize the effect when ALL of our rights began to be infringed. My contention would be a united effort of mass ‘peaceful’ demonstration. However, Obama wants that to happen so he can activate the ‘New’ fully armed DHS and FEMA Youth Corps. There is no excuse for ignorance with all of the informative web sites available. It is obvious that the FEMA reconstruction of old WWII POW camps and the New FEMA Camps, some with adjacent crematoriums, were and are prepared for “We the Sheeple”, IF and When we ever WAKE UP and decide to restore America to its ‘once #1 status! I may be 71, but I can still hit my target at over 1,000 yards … dead center. And my 68 year old wife is almost as good!! We’ll die fighting, not in a camp. THEY need to be hung for intended acts of treason, as far as I am concerned!!

      • Just curious, is Mr West an advocate of these fully armed agencies such as the DHS, FDAA, BLM, USPS, etc? Don’t here much of an outcry from him on these topics…

      • I’ll let you know, I have a personal e-mail to his office as I write this. The main ones we need to hear it from, we never will. Especially when we have Communists and Muslims guarding the “OUT” House(White House)!!

  75. I live in Dearborn Mi. which has one of the largest Muslim populations in the country. I can remember when the first big migration of Muslims to the U.S. occured in the mid 70s. Let me say this is just like when black people started moving in to previously all white neighborhoods in Detroit Mi. in the late 60s and the white people moved out. Instead of facing a potential change in a situation people always take the easy way out by running. This solves nothing, and it usually makes the situation worse. How can someone sit back and talk about something from a distance and pretend they are informing the masses? If you really want to know what is happening with the Muslims in America live with them and mingle with them. If more people would do this we could get a real understanding of the magnitude of the problem.

    • Why is it only our responsibility to reach out? They’re making a choice to come here and live. It’s up to them to make an effort at assimilating, which doesn’t mean abandoning their customs and religion, but it does mean that they need to respect us and our way of life. We’re open and accepting as a society, it’s one of our hallmarks, but we’ve been bending over backwards to accommodate Muslims at every turn and it shouldn’t be at the expense of our way of life or culture.

      • Our borders need to be CLOSED until we can get a Government in place that understands what we Americans want, what the muslins are about and their danger. If we focused our attentions to closing the border and removing the illegal aliens things would be much better for us as a whole.

    • The magnitude of the problem is that Islam belief is a complete contradiction to American core values. They are not tolerant to other religions and beliefs. They don’t believe in equality of the sexes or liberity. They don’t want to co-exist, they want to take over and impose Sharia Law on the rest of us. As long as they don’t have power, they are not a threat, but take a look at what is happening in Africa, Middle East and Asia. They force conversions and slaughter those that refuse. Even in Syria, the Islamist took over the role of rebels and in areas they control have been killing Christians, forcing conversions and raping the women even as they are fighting Assad.

  76. Allen West for President! We need an intelligent, patriotic and proud American to lead this country! The fact that everyone in power is basically trying to ignore him speaks volumes.

    • You’ve gotta be right about that. When neither side wants to know him, he’s doin’ somethin’ right. Same with Cruz. Republicans hate him. Democrats hate him. It says a lot…like you say. Yeah! I do like Allen West very much. And, I do trust him.

      • The only problem with Cruz is that he was born in Canada to an American mother. His father is Cuban American. Cubans have a special status with immediate American citizenship when they step foot onto our soil. I don’t know how that works out. However, West has the military and legislative experience we need now more than ever.

  77. We didn’t listen. 9-11. We heard them for the first time.
    We aren’t listening again. Not because we don’t understand, but whats worse is that we now ignore, deny reality, or minimize what we hear. The ragheads say “we will destroy america”, and attack an embassy, killing our Ambassador. The president says “they aren’t the enemy.” Taquyia, is muzzy’s lying to us. Now, it’s us lying to us. Give us the truth, and we will decide what needs to be done!

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